Study: Did a 757 hit the Pentagon?

[RedBean]

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Where did flight 77 go? I have no idea. How would I know? All I do know is the government has the power to do a lot of things with it. They could have gassed the passengers pre-flight and not destroyed the plane. They could have flown the plane into the ocean. Who knows?

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So all those hundreds of non-government air traffic controllers who watched Flight 77 on radar as it diverted from it's path, and then disappeared right over the pentagon airspace are apart of this vast conspiracy now also?

Sweet. After enough ridiculous explanations, we'll soon have everyone being a part of this massive conspiracy except for you and sheenfan.


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By the way, the engine wreckage you mentioned does not match up to the actual engine parts on one of the two engines in the 757.


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And your proof is what? A few nuts on the internet told you that? Or just because you say so?

That's how you nutjobs work, right? Just make up the 'facts' as you go along to support ridiculous fantasy theories.

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The black boxes were "found," but the government confiscated them and won't let anybody have access.


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Um....they were found. Who gets access to them is irrelevant. If flight 77 didn't hit the pentagon, then how would the black boxes have gotten there?

Oh I forgot, anytime something doesn't support the nutjob viewpoint, it is written of as a lie, or lumped in with the other hundreds of thousands of people who pulled of this magnificent tight conspiracy and fooled millions.

[RedBean]

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I could say it has indications that a missile struck;

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Indications a missile struck the pentagon?

Hmmm....are you basing this on the overwhelming amount of missile wreckage found at the site?

Or are you basing it on your vast experience with the effects of missile weaponry on reinforced concrete buildings?

Or are you just a nutjob conspiracy theorist who has to pull something out of your ass instead of accepting that flight 77 is what really hit the pentagon.

I'm going with door #3, Monty.

[SheenFan]

Why are you being so harsh?
You asked me for an answer, i complied.
It's just that a 16-foot hole on impact and an untouched lawn, in addition to the unreleased videos (that you have yet to touch upon) has me questioning this "official" story that you swear by.
Stop with the name-calling.
Just because I don't subscribe to the "official" story, don't start lowering yourself with the name-calling.

[CORed]

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people who were more scared of the boxcutters than dying in a plane crash

[/ QUOTE ] Gee, you think maybe the people in the first three planes didn't know the hijackers intended to fly the planes into buildings? It seems like once the passengers knew what was up, they did try to save themselves (Oops! I forgot. That plane was shot down on your planet).
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16-foot pre-collapse hole was caused by a 757

[/ QUOTE ] Seems to be conflicting information about that 16-foot hole. The 16 foot number seems only to be cited on wacko sites. Also, I'm not enough of an engineer to know exactly how big a hole a 757 flying into reinforced concrete would make. A 757 is has a lot of empty space. i don't find it at all unbelievable that it wouldld crush and fragment on impact. Not as unbelievable as the idea that our own military took it out with a missile, to be sure.
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Larry Silverstein, the owner of the WTC, was lying when he said on video that "we pulled the building,"

[/ QUOTE ] So the guy you're accusing of insurance fraud a few sentences later is a credible source of information? BTW, I'm not sure what "pulled the building" means. Nor do I know what context he said that in, if in fact he said it.
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fire on two floors could cause a 47 story building to collapse

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According to the "official" version, that fire involved several thousand gallons of diesel fuel, and the building was already severely damaged by falling debris from the towers. I find that more believable than mega-conspiracies.
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Larry Silverstein took out a $2.2 billion insurance claim on the entire WTC complex just weeks before 9/11. He made $500 million off building 7 alone!

[/ QUOTE ] So he filed a claim before it happened? Oh, I get it, you don't know the difference between an insurance claim and an insurance policy. Gee, he insured his buildings. Guilty! Nobody insures their property unless they're planning to destroy it. I think if I owned those buildings, I might insure them too, and if they collapsed, I'd probably file a claim. He "made" 500 million? Wow that claims adjuster ought to be fired. Or did you not figure tha value of the loss in that equation? I bet not.

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Also, the government had offices for the IRS, the EEOC, the US Secret Service, the SEC, and the CIA - all in building 7.
Sweet! Larry gets new buildings and the government agencies get new offices!

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Oh! It all makes sense now. The government hatched the whole 9/11 conspiracy so some government agencies could get new offices! How could I not see that? I guess they just knocked down the two main towers and fired a missile into the Pentagon as a diversion.
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Well, I already showed you some evidence for building 7.

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Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha ha! OMG! You actually think that's evidence? That's even funnier than a donk capping the river when his 95 offsuit catches a counterfeited second pair with 4 to an open-ended straight flush on the board.

Hint: When I say "evidence" I mean something physical evidence supporting explosive demolition, or credible witnesses who say they participated in the conspiracy (preferably more than one), you know, something a little stronger than uneducated speculation on whether a huge fire could or could not have caused a building to collapse, and inuendo based on the fact that the owner of the building (shock!) insured that building. Do I think the government may be withholding some information about 9/11? Yes. Do I think they are doing that to cover up some insane conspiracy to create a fake terrorist attack? No way in hell. Not without some real eveidence to back it up. I put this stuff on the same level as the fake moon landing or chemtrails, and a step down form most of the JFK assassination conspiracy theories.

[RedBean]

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Why are you being so harsh?


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Obviously, because I am one of the millions of people complicit in this vast conspiracy to discredit those of you few out there who know the truth and are trying to foil our evil plans.

The future of our undercover alien takeover depends on truth seekers like you not being believable to the uninformed masses, so it is neccesary for agents such as myself to take harsh actions.

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Stop with the name-calling.
Just because I don't subscribe to the "official" story, don't start lowering yourself with the name-calling.

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When I say "nutjob conspiracy theorist", I am not calling names, I am merely calling it like it is. My apologies, and I will refrain from it in the future.

Oops, it's already afternoon, dammit, today is my turn to feed the captive passengers from flight 77 that we gassed and are now holding for all of eternity in Area 51. Gotta run.....

[CORed]

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Um....they were found. Who gets access to them is irrelevant. If flight 77 didn't hit the pentagon, then how would the black boxes have gotten there?

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A minor disagreement. IMO those recorders should be made public. The fact that they haven't been doesn't support the missile "theory", though.

[benfranklin]

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It's just that a 16-foot hole on impact

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The 16 foot hole was in the C-Ring of the Pentagon. It was made after the 757 passed through the outer E-Ring and the D-Ring.

Structural engineers invvestigating the site estimated the pre-collapse hole in the E-Ring to be 75 feet wide. This was later confirmed by computer models.

[vulturesrow]

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It's just that a 16-foot hole on impact

[/ QUOTE ]

The 16 foot hole was in the C-Ring of the Pentagon. It was made after the 757 passed through the outer E-Ring and the D-Ring.

Structural engineers invvestigating the site estimated the pre-collapse hole in the E-Ring to be 75 feet wide. This was later confirmed by computer models.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dont muddy up this thread with facts .

[illeagle]

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So all those hundreds of non-government air traffic controllers who watched Flight 77 on radar as it diverted from it's path, and then disappeared right over the pentagon airspace are apart of this vast conspiracy now also?


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http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...32597-2001Nov2
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The airliner that slammed into the Pentagon on Sept. 11 disappeared from controllers' radar screens for at least 30 minutes -- in part because it was hijacked in an area of limited radar coverage. That gap cost military and aviation officials valuable warning time, according to officials and other sources.

Investigators are still piecing together the facts in the hijacking of American Airlines Flight 77. But the sector of limited radar coverage at an Indianapolis "en route center" helps explain one of its mysteries: Why did the Boeing 757 simply disappear from radar screens for a half-hour or more, turn aroundover southern Ohio and get back into Washington airspace before anyone noticed it or knew that it had been hijacked?

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It is a possibility that while off the radar, flight 77 was replaced with a drone at an area air force base like the plan put forth in declassified Operation Northwoods memo. We don't know for sure because an independent investigation hasn't been allowed.

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/Northwoods.html
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8. It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate
convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down
a chartered civil airliner enroute from the United States to
Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would
be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba.
The passengers could be a group of college students off on a
holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to
support chartering a non-scheduled flight.

a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and
numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered
aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the
Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be
subsituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be
loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under
carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered
aircraft would be converted to a drone.

b. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual
aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rendezvous south of
Florida. From the rendezvous point the passenger-carrying
aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly
into an auxiliary field at Eglin AFB where arrangements will
have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the
aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft
meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight plan. When
over Cuba the drone will being transmitting on the inter-
national distress frequency a "MAY DAY" message stating he
is under attack by Cuban MIG aircraft. The transmission
will be interrupted by the destruction of aircraft which will
be triggered by radio signal.

[/ QUOTE ]
At the very least, the Operation Northwoods memo is proof that the US government has conspired to commit terrorist acts against its own population on order to instigate war. Yes Virginia, there are conspiracies.

It'd be great if you could knock off the incessant ad hominem attacks.

[benfranklin]

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Glad you asked. I'm sure you didn't know this, but Larry Silverstein took out a $2.2 billion insurance claim on the entire WTC complex just weeks before 9/11. He made $500 million off building 7 alone!

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So Silverstein took out a big policy and then paid the Mafia to destroy them so he could cash in? And the Mafia outsourced the job to bin Laden, right? Because they couldn't find any goodfellas that wanted to go for a short flight.

Actually, the insurance policy (policy, not claim) was for $3.55 billion. The policy was taken out in July of 2001 because that was the effective date of the lease, when Silverstein's company took over management and operations from the Port Authority.