My Basic Thought On Free Will

[drzen]

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I agree that my argument fails if the reason we don't have free will is because God programmed us. Because he could also program us to wonder about free will. But not even religious people suggest that so I'm starting with the assumption that it isn't true.

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So your argument is basically that if there is a God, he must have endowed us with free will because we are free to wonder about having free will?

This almost has to be true because most other explanations would be defeated by there being a god of the type Christian theology requires. That god can hardly have created machines that have the illusion of free will as an emergent property because they would not fit his stated purpose.

Without God, the argument is far harder to make. We lack understanding of what the human mind consists of, so there is a handy gap for blatherers to pour their theories into. But there being a gap that you can fill does not make what you fill it with correct.

[MCS]

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I'm pretty sure that I have the jist of a proof that free will exists. Intuitively I am almost certain of it.

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well, just scribble in a margin somewhere.



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Brilliant.

[Guruman]

does not our regret for certain actions prove that we made those choices freely? If we were coerced then we would not regret them methinks.

you know: "Fk! why did I do that?" / "Well you certainly didn't have to moron."

[Borknagar]

Come on David, that´s no proof at all. You can program a computer to wonder and discuss if he has free will. Does that make it free as well, of course not.

[Shane Michael]

people have ssssoooooooo much free will.

its seems quite simple but, you create your own reality.

[soon2bepro]

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the fact is that free will is a lot like what pornography was to that judge. "I know it when I see it".

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When I first read this I thought it was a joke. Now after reading through the rest of your post(s) on the matter, I see that it's not.

So, basically you're saying that you cannot say what free will is; furthermore, your seem to be implying that no one can. Then how do you figure it can be proven to be true?

Surely you understand that in order to reason about a certain subject, you must first understand what it is that you want to think about. But even if you do understand it logically, which from your statement I doubt you can, others won't. So the whole analysis (whatever it is) can be safely flushed down the drain. It's useless.

I would probably have much to say about the subject if I actually knew what it was.

I want to add that if you take a popular definition of free will = "uncaused, non-random decision", the implications of it's existence are merely the result of mystical/wishful thinking. There is no sound logical argument to suggest the existence of such a thing.

[Shane Michael]

i dissagree,
this is where free will comes into play.

theres no way every action, thought would be the same.
whats the point in that?
the objective is to be creative.

[Shane Michael]

science can only prove physical evidence

[Shane Michael]

it is acutally not from physical causes. the cause is manifested in physical terms.

[David Sklansky]

"Come on David, that´s no proof at all. You can program a computer to wonder and discuss if he has free will."

No you can't. Nor can anybody.