weak top pair

[neeeel]

Hero is in the SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

preflop
UTG folds, UTG + 1 calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, 3 folds, Hero completes, BB checks

flop comes 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG + 1 bets, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, <font color="red"> Hero raises </font> ,BB folds, <font color="red"> UTG + 1 3-bets </font>, MP2 folds, Hero calls

turn comes 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
Hero checks, UTG + 1 bets, Hero folds

Comments please.
Preflop is maybe a bit loose, but theres a few ppl in , and its only costing me half a SB.
On the flop, I am never sure wether to donk if there has been no preflop raise, and i connect with the flop, admittedly my hand here is very weak, should i have just check folded?
I generally do bet out if i have top or mid pair with a decent kicker, and there was no preflop raise, i felt i would rather see what other people did this time
what do people think about the check raise? I wanted to get the BB to fold, and see how much villain liked his hand, is this just a waste of money?
I was tempted to fold after the 3-bet, but called and folded the turn UI

[Set_Wenker]

I would bet the flop to try and pick up the pot. When raised I don't really like the hand anymore. But probably call to see the turn.

I definitely don't like checkraising UTG+1 there are players behind him and there are few draws, so he probably has a hand already. By checkraising you commit the other players to the hand and you suffer reversed implied odds.

[martybonus]

hrm, i'm interested to see what the others think.

This one seems a bit out of my depth but i'm going to try anyway.

I don't think i like this. I think betting out would be the play I'd go for here. You'd bet, he'd raise, you could either call and fold turn UI or fold right there.

But because you raised, you almost feel compelled to call the 3bet even though it's a clear sign that you're almost certainly beat.

dunno, this just smells like 'tricky play gone wrong' to me.

I don't think i'd have the discipline to fold here, but I am less than confident that c/r &gt;&gt; call &gt;&gt; fold.

IMO it seems like bet &gt; c/c &gt; fold.

but i'm interested to see wehat others think. Nice post IMO

[Neku]

I guess he's reacting to the fact that you're limping in, and then checkraising on a weak flop. If your hand was stronger, you would probably have tried a steal on the preflop pot (especially with so many ppl in).

When you didn't do that but checkraised after this (low) flop, he probably read you correctly as trying to steal the pot.

[kerowo]

Pre-flop is fine.

What is the table like? Is there a lot of folding or raising? What is UTG+1 like? Is he aggressive with over cards or draws? Or is he passive?

Checkraising this flop with a weak hand is only good if you have a table image that is tight and, more importantly, people at the table are paying attention to your table image. So basically, no good.

I think a better line is leading this flop and if you get raised trying to use your reads to narrow down what UTG+1 is raising with. As played and with no reads fold the turn.

[Todd]

I am tempted to say fold to the flop reraise, but with the immediate odds of around 13:1 you can definately see if you can spike an 8 or 9, and hope that villain doesnt have a set.

On the turn, your odds are ~7:1 and I think you have to let go.

Todd

[Aaron W.]

Preflop is fine.

The flop play is tough because of your position and the number of villains in the pot. I don't mind checking to see what happens.

I think it's fine as played since you didn't give any information about UTG+1. There is a reasonable chance he has TT/99 and didn't raise preflop, or has A8/K8 and has you outkicked.

Another line is to check-call the flop (since MP2 called already) and then lead out on the turn.

[tyler_cracker]

this is fine. leading the flop sucks.

[neeeel]

thanks for all the comments.
Tyler, why does leading the flop suck? I nearly always bet if i have something, check if i dont.

i like c/c the flop and b/f the turn. then probably c/c river.(although i wouldn't like to overcall the river against 2 passive opponents)