Theory

[gimmetheloot]

Lol @ 3balling all of these most of the time.

Save it.

[Noam Chomsky]

The thing is that I didn't say I'd be three betting YOU this light. I said that I'd be three betting a 22/18 regular who I'm assuming is opening 40% of his hands on the button this light, with 100bb stacks some vague, undefined percentage of the time.

I'm doing this to exploit HIS button opening range. If he decides to adjust and tighten up his opening range (in other words, he's no longer that guy), I will obviously adjust as well.

Maybe there are players at higher stakes who can continue to open 40% from the button and exploit a light three bettor from the blinds with 100bb stacks but they just don't seem to exist at 200nl and to be honest, I'm not sure how one would go about this. You'd just have to be playing back with such a huge range of hands with so little behind and so little room to maneuver.

I'm interested to hear more thoughts about this (I'd love to know how to play back at light three bettors better other than tightening up and light four-betting) but I feel like people are thinking that no matter what adjustments are made by the button, I'm just going to keep bombing away and that's just not true. I was responding specifically to a 22/18 regular who in my experience is opening far too wide a range otb to make it anything but profitable to three bet him wide. Against the majority of opponents, I'm folding at least half of these hands nearly every time.

[futuredoc85]

[ QUOTE ]
The thing is that I didn't say I'd be three betting YOU this light. I said that I'd be three betting a 22/18 regular who I'm assuming is opening 40% of his hands on the button this light, with 100bb stacks some vague, undefined percentage of the time.

I'm doing this to exploit HIS button opening range. If he decides to adjust and tighten up his opening range (in other words, he's no longer that guy), I will obviously adjust as well.

Maybe there are players at higher stakes who can continue to open 40% from the button and exploit a light three bettor from the blinds with 100bb stacks but they just don't seem to exist at 200nl and to be honest, I'm not sure how one would go about this. You'd just have to be playing back with such a huge range of hands with so little behind and so little room to maneuver.

I'm interested to hear more thoughts about this (I'd love to know how to play back at light three bettors better other than tightening up and light four-betting) but I feel like people are thinking that no matter what adjustments are made by the button, I'm just going to keep bombing away and that's just not true. I was responding specifically to a 22/18 regular who in my experience is opening far too wide a range otb to make it anything but profitable to three bet him wide. Against the majority of opponents, I'm folding at least half of these hands nearly every time.

[/ QUOTE ]

i am like 23/19, i should have said that in my response. the thing is that you arent really going to know w/in the space of one session whether he has tightened his LP range or widened it or w/e. As far as how to play back, its hard to just explain in a paragraph. You have to have some idea of ranges for 3-betting and c-betting and use that to determine what flops are good to bluff-shove or stack off light on. Go to a 5/10 table and watch someone like 20buckspin play. All the time i see people 3-bet him light b/c he is so loose pf and he just calls and rapes them by shoving over the c-bets. They try to adjust but usually they either end up just c/f when they miss or bet/calling too light and get valuetowned by marginal hands.

[Noam Chomsky]

oh, my bad, I got the impression from Luego's well thread that you were like 20/16.

Yeah, I guess I see guys occasionally that shove over c-bets in three bet pots and don't know how I could ever be that guy. Deep down, I'm a total nit when it comes to playing for stacks. I'm much more about implying that I'm playing for stacks. On what frequency is it really needed to beat higher stakes?

FWIW, I do think I'm ok at noticing the adjustments that people are making against me within the span of one session, if it's someone who I'm concerned about, though, from a theoretical standpoint, you really don't need to against a 'regular' as every hand you play against that person forever is really just one long session, right?

[Isura]

[ QUOTE ]

Maybe there are players at higher stakes who can continue to open 40% from the button and exploit a light three bettor from the blinds with 100bb stacks but they just don't seem to exist at 200nl and to be honest, I'm not sure how one would go about this. You'd just have to be playing back with such a huge range of hands with so little behind and so little room to maneuver.

[/ QUOTE ]

The adjustments aren't THAT hard, although it takes some time away from the tables to figure these things out. I could lay out the proper adjustments but 90% of the people wouldn't have the discipline and patience to let variance take its toll and show long term results.

[clowntable]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Maybe there are players at higher stakes who can continue to open 40% from the button and exploit a light three bettor from the blinds with 100bb stacks but they just don't seem to exist at 200nl and to be honest, I'm not sure how one would go about this. You'd just have to be playing back with such a huge range of hands with so little behind and so little room to maneuver.

[/ QUOTE ]

The adjustments aren't THAT hard, although it takes some time away from the tables to figure these things out. I could lay out the proper adjustments but 90% of the people wouldn't have the discipline and patience to let variance take its toll and show long term results.

[/ QUOTE ]
By all means, lay it out.
p.s.: What would you (as in y'all) do if you held the hands mentioned in OP and are Button and being 3bet from BB who you assume to be a 2+2er?

[WelshChip]

all the hands all the time

[ama0330]

[ QUOTE ]
all the hands all the time

[/ QUOTE ]

qft, is this thread a joke?

[clowntable]

[ QUOTE ]
all the hands all the time

[/ QUOTE ]
There's probably some zen in this answer that I'm missing.

[futuredoc85]

that it depends on so many things besides your hand and there isnt one thing you should always do prob.