Ceaser's Palace, Las Vegas - New BJ Rules (Multi-Deck)

ThreeBeers · #1 04-05-2007, 03:14 PM

Has anyone noticed that Ceaser's Palace has changed the Blackjack (multi-deck) rules (in the forum pits) so that the player can only double-down when the player has 10 or 11. This is crazy. I would be interested in knowing how big of an advantage the house gets with the change. Since none of the casinos (even other harrah's properties) have followed suit, I have switched from Ceaser's.

ThreeBeers

cardcounter0 · #2 04-05-2007, 04:04 PM

Only being able to double down on 10 or 11 adds the following to the house edge:

2 decks 0.211%
4 decks 0.185%
6 decks 0.176%
8 decks 0.172%

ThreeBeers · #3 04-05-2007, 04:07 PM

Thanks for the post. Does anyone have any idea (other than the obvious - the house wants a bigger edge) why they made the change and why the change does not include pit #3 (which I lovingly call "The Scene of the Crime").

ThreeBeers

cardcounter0 · #4 04-05-2007, 04:29 PM

Years ago, having been thrown out of Ceasars in handcuffs after being forced to pay for a comped room and comped meal under threat of jail, I don't know much about the new Ceasars.

I would say "the house wants a bigger edge", the obvious answer, is the correct one. The new owners, Harrahs, is the biggest leader in ruining blackjack and always testing the limits of how to fleece the suckers quicker. They were the driving force behind 6:5 blackjack.

I would speculate that Ceasars is being used as a test ground to see how the chumps accept restricted doubling. This would also explain why one pit doesn't have the rule change. They can directly observe how many tourists will pass the bad rules tables, and go to pit #3. If all the tables remain packed, and people seem indifferent to playing one or the other, I could see these rules spreading to the other Harrah properties.

ThreeBeers · #5 04-05-2007, 04:37 PM

That makes sense to me. Never thought about movement of the players from the Forum Pits to Pit#3. By the way, the Forum Pits now inlcude the "Pussy Cat Doll Casino" which is simply an additional pit where hot chicks in skimpy outfits are the dealers. Pit #3 is the Center pit when you walk in the front door. I hope people start complaining. I am not a very big player (just barely a Platinum Card holder) so the loss of my play will be no big deal. However, I did tell my host the reason that I was leaving and she said she has heard a couple of other players complain too. By the way would love to hear the story behind you getting removed from Ceaser's.

Thanks again
ThreeBeers

playersare · #6 04-05-2007, 05:08 PM

I will arrive in LV tomorrow and am staying in Caesars Augustus Tower for 3 days (Diamond tier). will confirm these changes when I get back.

cardcounter0 · #7 04-05-2007, 05:12 PM

I would often fly in to Vegas several times a month for a weekend and go on Blackjack runs. I didn't have rooms or reservations, would simply get a comped room whenever I needed. I went into Ceasars in the evening after having played for about the past 36 hours and three backoffs. Being hungry, I asked for a meal which was granted based on my previous play. I ate a nice steak, and then wandered around the casino, and found a pit that was half asleep. I pounded them hard for a couple of hours and managed to extract a little over 10k. Then lack of sleep prompted me to ask for a room. Since I had been playing up to 3 hands at $500 a pop, they comped me a room, and I went off to sleep.

I think what happened was there was a shift change, a table reports a 10k loss, and a new security team starts reviewing tapes. Hey, who was asleep at the switch? Look at this guy! Hey, he is still on the property in a comped room. And so, shortly after, there is a pounding at my door, and I am greeted by 3 security goons. I get dressed, they handcuff me for "my protection", and they lead me thru the casino to the front desk. At the front desk, a few of LVPD's finest show up (probably cousins or brother-in-laws to the security goons) and I am presented with bills for the room and my comped meal. I am informed I will be charged with "defrauding an inn keeper" if I don't pay up.

So I know this is a bogus rap, but I will still be spending the rest of the night in jail, will have to post bond, deal with a judge in the morning, blah, blah, blah. Besides, the food at Clark County is only slightly above the buffet at Circus Circus, and this will be cutting into my average $52 per hour expectation. So I pay off the bills, flash some of my roll, and ask "Don't you guys want a chance to win some of this back?" The management is not amused, I am escorted to the front door and uncuffed, and told not to come back. Then some flunky follows me with some trespass papers he wants me to sign all the way to the edge of the property line.

I cross the street to the Flamingo, get a comp on a room, and resume getting some shut eye, before continuing with getting ejected from a few more joints (if you aren't getting kicked out, you are not doing it right).

ReidDeCardes · #8 04-06-2007, 02:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Has anyone noticed that Ceaser's Palace has changed the Blackjack (multi-deck) rules (in the forum pits) so that the player can only double-down when the player has 10 or 11. This is crazy. I would be interested in knowing how big of an advantage the house gets with the change. Since none of the casinos (even other harrah's properties) have followed suit, I have switched from Ceaser's.

ThreeBeers

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm surprised at this. Not doubting, just surprised. But then again with the push for 6:5 "single deck" being so strong nothing should be surprising. I had read somewhere that the Pussycat lounge has horrible rules, so I am hoping that is there that this is happening and not in the rest of the casino.

The sad thing is that they had a good game, according to CBJN back in September, only a .26 house edge.

playersare · #9 04-10-2007, 02:13 PM

just got back from LV, looks like almost all the low limit tables (not just the pussycat pit) have been converted to H17, D10/11, NDAS, NS - house edge just below a full 1%. also looks like the original Palace casino tables (aforementioned .26) are now H17 as well - couldn't confirm LS or RSA though. didn't check the VIP pits but I can't imagine there being any good BJ here under $100, if not $500.

coupled with the massive downgrade of good VP a few months back, harrah's has unfortunately killed the original gambling spirit of Caesars Palace. It was extremely tough to find anything worth playing at any of their LV properties this trip (ran decent at the Harrah's double deck when it was $10/$15 but that was about it). just hope it doesn't spread farther out to their other markets.

ThreeBeers · #10 04-10-2007, 02:41 PM

I am heading back out to Vegas this week. As noted in my previous post, I moved my reservations from Ceaser's to The Rio. Did you play at the Rio? My buddy is going with me went out last week and noted that The Rio has the normal rules and were unaware of the changes at Ceaser's.

ThreeBeers