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#21
08-31-2007, 01:33 PM
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Re: Q7s MONSTER hand
Sorry, should have been more clear. It's not about folding his air once he's raised the turn..
Its about not having him play back at you once you've c/r the flop and you have air. Folding out all his hands that completely miss the flop (I called it air). This is where the profit comes from. Him being correct in raising middle pair for value AND showing down to your 3-bet. Him being correct in bluff/value raising the turn way more if you dont 3-bet this hand. You being correct in calling down the raise with any pair. You being correct to 3-bet some good draws. This is not spew, it's good poker. Most of those variables are no longer true if his preflop raising distribution is tighter... or if you choose to not re-steal agressivly on flops like this 
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#22
08-31-2007, 01:52 PM
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Re: Q7s MONSTER hand
Maybe Stox's line is better against good TAGs who will fold to a 3bet here. (the had was 150/300). However, I think against LAGs and weaker players (say, at 10/20?) this line loses value because they aren't going to fold a piece here, and you beat most pieces.
Plus there is always the 4bet bluff/spew potential from your opponent, after which you can c/c the river (or c/r a boat, or possibly b/c a flush)
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#23
09-02-2007, 03:44 AM
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Re: Q7s MONSTER hand
I'm still with Stox here. Against a player who is capable of folding AA-KK to a 3-bet you are losing value. You are losing value against an opponent who will bluff bet a missed draw on the river. You are also saving value from better Qs and boats. You are definitely losing value against showdown monkeys. It seems that overall you are maximizing reward and minimizing risk against the total range but maybe you guys run into more spew monkeys than I do. When I see a 4-bet here I'm almost always beat and getting villain to fold is -EV.
YT
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#24
09-02-2007, 05:33 AM
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Re: Q7s MONSTER hand
Hmmm I think like 2% of the players I play with would fold AA here.. I do play against mostly spew monkies tho...
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#25
09-02-2007, 09:17 AM
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Re: Q7s MONSTER hand
[ QUOTE ]
A) getting a worse hand that is drawing dead or near dead to fold [/ QUOTE ] depending on image and game conditions and such, there are also so many hands that are drawing dead or near dead that will never fold and will call you down. i'm talking about a range as wide as AA to A high
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