10-20, fold or call down?

[RobA]

Sorry this is a lot of reading, but I try to group together decisions at similar points in hands to look for patterns/try to tease out why a call may be good in one spot but not another.

10-20 in AC.

Hand 1: Villain (BB) in this hand has clearly establish himself as not good at poker. He limped 23s UTG, then called when it was 3-bet back to him. He also limped J2s UTG. He's aggresive post-flop and been caught bluffing a few times in the 90 minutes he's been at the table (but also pulled in some big pots). He also bet out/3-bet when he hit an a-high one-card flush on the river. He's basically a bad lag.

3 limps to me on the button with J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and I call. Flop is A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB checks. Villain in BB bets. Fold. Solid MP calls. Fold. I call. SB folds.

Turn Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Villain bets, MP calls, I raise, Villain calls, MP folds.

River T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Villain donks. I?

Hand 2: UTG+1 limps (seen him limp once so far in his few orbits at the table, and it was 32s, saw him raise and it was AK). I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] next in. Villain from hand 1 CCs (as he does on 50% of my raises) in MP. LP (ok, but losing LAG) 3-bets. Blinds fold. All call. 4 to flop for 13.5SB.

Flop Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Check, check, check to LP who bets. UTG+1 calls. I call. MP folds.

Turn T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Check, check to LP who bets. UTG +1 folds. I call.

River 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. I check, LP bets. I?.

Hand 3: Now I'm on a serious heater for the past 30 minutes including raising pre-flop and winning the last 3 hands. The villains from hand 1 and 2 hate me and are glaring at me.

9 handed right now. UTG folds. I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in UTG +1. Villain from hand 1 (sucks) CCs again in MP. Villain from hand 2 (also sucks but not as bad, has CC with JTo and QJo so far) also CCs in LP. Blinds fold.

Flop A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

I bet, MP calls, LP calls.

Turn 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

I bet, MP calls, LP raises, I call, MP calls.

River 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Check, Check to LP who bets. I?.

I appreciate all comments. Particularly interested in the river decisions and if they are close. And also comments on other spots in these hands that look bad.

Thank you very much for input.

[CardSharpCook]

cripes, dude. You need to learn on how to edit. I'll help make this readable. Basically, be clear and concise. We know you found it amusing when a donkey called with 23o, but just tell us he is LPP (Loose Passive preflop, Passive postflop)

[CardSharpCook]

10-20 in AC
Hand 1: Villain (BB) is a bad lag.

3 limps, hero calls on btn with J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

Flop(6SB) A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
SB checks. BB bets. Fold. Solid MP calls. Fold. I call. SB folds.

Turn(4.5BB) Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
BB bets, MP calls, I raise, BB calls, MP folds.

River(8.5BB) T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
BB donks. I?





Hand 2: UTG+1 limps (relative unknown). I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] next in. Villain from hand 1 CCs in MP. LP (ok, but losing LAG) 3-bets. Blinds fold. All call. 4 to flop for 13.5SB.

Flop Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
check to LP who bets. UTG+1 calls. I call. MP folds.

Turn(8bb) T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
check to LP who bets. UTG +1 folds. I call.

River(10BB) 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
I check, LP bets. I?.




Hand 3: My image may be getting LAGgy due to running good.

I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in UTG +1. Villain from hand 1 CCs in MP. Villain from hand 2 (also sucks but not as bad, has CC with JTo and QJo so far) CCs in LP. Blinds fold.

Flop(7SB) A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

I bet, MP calls, LP calls.

Turn(4.5BB) 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
I bet, MP calls, LP raises, I call, MP calls.

River(10.5bb) 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Check to LP who bets. I?.




I appreciate all comments. Particularly interested in the river decisions and if they are close. And also comments on other spots in these hands that look bad.

Thank you very much for input.

[CardSharpCook]

You'll see that this is easier to read. The hands are separated (I actually think it is a good idea to make 3 separate posts). Extranious info like the specific holdings of specific players in specific OTHER hands is excluded. This reduces the problem to the math of it. Other info that can be included in a live setting are possible reads or mannerisms. Also, it can be helpful to include the size of the pot at each street. This is more useful in NL hands, but it is a good habit to get into.

Don't mean to be too much of a nit, but I see that you are new to the forums and you should be taught how to post in a way that is easy to read as it will help those trying to help you.

Now, let me evaluate the hands...

[CardSharpCook]

Hand 1:
I actually like raising JTs here, as this hand plays well multiway, and a bigger pot actually helps you. I don't like the flop call, as you are drawing to 3 outs, frequently, and the pot is too small. Additionally, you don't close the action (but that is close - only SB left to act). I like your turn raise. Given your read on BB, I call this river. Bad LAGs like to bluff and you're getting 9.5:1 on the call. I'd probably call getting 3:1 with that read.

Hand 2:
You can certainly fold ATo UTG+2 with a limper already in the pot. If you're going to play it, raising is probably correct. You can certainly fold this turn, but deciding that LP has AK is fine. If you call the turn, you have to call the river - which is why you fold the turn.

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 27.050% 24.95% 02.10% 505 42.50 { AcTd }
Hand 1: 72.950% 70.85% 02.10% 1434 42.50 { TT+, AJs+, KQs, AQo+ }

Getting 9:2 means that this is actually a call down given this range.



Hand 3:
[ QUOTE ]
My image may be getting LAGgy due to running good.

I raise A 9 in UTG +1

[/ QUOTE ]
Gee, I wonder why they think you're LAGgy. In many games, it is ok to limp a9s here, in other games, it is a fold. That is, in passive games, it is ok to play passively first in, in EP. Given that you have a LAGgy image, you should be more inclined to not raise this trash. As for the rest of the hand, the river doesn't matter. Make your decision on the turn. Fold there, or call down regardless.

From these hands, it appears you have two holes in your game. Your EP raising standards appear too light. Secondly, and more importantly, you seem to have turn problems. I used to play with this SLAGgy guy, who I initially had pegged as a fish, but learned (or thought I learned) that he was actually a winning player. He used to curse out players in the chat box, and I love to chat, so I'd talk back to him. We became admiring poker acquiantences. Whenever we were sitting at the same table that'd break, we'd keep that table open and chat sometimes. Anyway, he passed along this basic philosophy: Bad flop calls lead to bad turn calls which lead to bad river calls. This philosophy is how he could make is stupid-agro, too loose style of play work. This may be a problem with your overall game.

[ssmallz]

Hand 1: Fold the river you're just not good. The board is super scary and he's betting into you after you raised 2 players and repped hitting a flush or strait. Theres no hand you beat except a bluff. Find better spots to pick off a bluff

Hand 2: Depending on the game this is a fold pf. If its a tight online game where people love to fold to my raises I jack it up. Live though, I can usually expect a few cold callers so I just toss it or limp w/it if they're really bad. Flop and turn are fine b/c you have 3 outs on the flop and likely 6 on the turn. Just fold the river though b/c this guy 3 bet a large field pf and bet at every opportunity into multiple opponents. Middle pair is just no good.

Hand 3: Same advice pf I gave you in the last hand except never fold. Its ok to limp there in loose games but sometimes raise if the game is tight. You can prolly fold this on the turn. MPs turn raise on 2 people means tpwk is just no good and you're drawing to your kicker at best and dead the majority of the time. River is an easy fold. You're likely behind LP and MP might have just hit a flush and be looking to c/r the field

[RobA]

ok, i got it. i'll make them shorter from now on. sorry. still learning the proper way to post. ... i really appreciate your feedback on the hands.