AA lots of flop action

RIDGE45 · #1 06-28-2006, 02:12 AM

No good reads. Have not gotten involved much with the other deep stack. Semi Shorty hasn't been doing that great.

Poker Room skin
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.15/$0.25
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $15.05
RIDGE: $54.90
CO: $78.45
Button: $17.50
SB: $26.95
BB: $44.75

Pre-flop: (6 players) RIDGE is UTG+1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG calls, RIDGE raises to $1.7, CO calls, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG calls.

Flop: 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($7.2, 4 players)
UTG checks, RIDGE bets $4, CO raises to $10, Button raises all-in $15.8, UTG folds, RIDGE??

I'm not too worried about the shorter stack. This could be any overpair IMO.

What is my plan for the rest of the hand?

If I call I'm OOP in a bloated pot with a deepstack behind me yet to act?

The only hands I'm scared of are 2x and 44, so should I be looking to maximize my value or treating this as a WA/WB? I think the range CO raises my "C-bet" with is very large in this situation.

Thanks,

[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]RIDGE[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

RIDGE45 · #2 06-28-2006, 02:25 AM

We'll just go ahead and BUMP this little guy one time.

Burdzthewurd · #3 06-28-2006, 02:40 AM

Can you really see either calling preflop with a deuce? A2s is a pretty big stretch I think. You only can be afraid of 44 here, which hopefully the Button rather than CO has, if it's out. Your bet looks like a continuation bet, so is it possible CO raises a small overpair like 55-TT here? Honestly I don't think I get away from this and just shove.

notevenhere · #4 06-28-2006, 02:44 AM

I can't put anyone on 2x, so I am going to throw that out.

If either Villain has the 44, this is trouble. Fold seems too weak, since 44 is really the only hand you fear. Yet calling OOP spells trouble unless CO is willing to go to the felt with any PP.

I'd like to know how others would play this as well, as I am completely lost.

[ QUOTE ]
Can you really see either calling preflop with a deuce? A2s is a pretty big stretch I think. You only can be afraid of 44 here, which hopefully the Button rather than CO has, if it's out. Your bet looks like a continuation bet, so is it possible CO raises a small overpair like 55-TT here? Honestly I don't think I get away from this and just shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you really want the button to have the 44, if your decision is to push? CO is often going to fold to this much aggression, which leaves you heads up vs a boat with only 2 outs and no side pot.

OXIO · #5 06-28-2006, 02:51 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Can you really see either calling preflop with a deuce? A2s is a pretty big stretch I think. You only can be afraid of 44 here, which hopefully the Button rather than CO has, if it's out. Your bet looks like a continuation bet, so is it possible CO raises a small overpair like 55-TT here? Honestly I don't think I get away from this and just shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you really want to play for your stack here, why would you just shove it? I think its better to flat call, and c/r all in on the turn, so that you extract more value out of smaller pocket pairs, that would just fold to your reraise all in on the flop. Or extract some additional value on the river if it get checked through on the turn.

On the other hand, i think OP should have led the flop with a bigger bet, so his opponents would be less opportunistic about snapping off the CB with a raise. When the bet was so small, any pocket pair might have reraised OP, because he should have AK right? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] In any case, im just flat calling the reraise and see what other deep stack does. If he is pushing it, im out of it.

RIDGE45 · #6 06-28-2006, 03:05 AM

Yeah, I think the best line is to flat call the flop. CO is probably folding to any more aggression BUT might see my raise as an attempt to isolate the short stack.

I think the goal here is to find a line that extracts most from the CO.

Another question: Are you folding if CO raises after you flat call? The more I Think about the more I think there is no way we can fold this hand. If I just call I have not shown any strenght in this hand (c-betting followed by call). He may think any PP is good here.

Also, Why would CO: A. raise originally when he flopped top full house and there is still someone to act behind him, and B. then raise it again after a shorty goes all in (part B is speaking hypothetically? I think there is no way we can put CO on 44...given the action thus far. So, I think our focus becomes value.

Any other thoughts?

OXIO · #7 06-28-2006, 03:17 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Also, Why would CO: A. raise originally when he flopped top full house and there is still someone to act behind him, and B. then raise it again after a shorty goes all in (part B is speaking hypothetically? I think there is no way we can put CO on 44...given the action thus far. So, I think our focus becomes value.

Any other thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well considering the flop, he can reraise to just start building the pot immediately, since you will have overpair quite often, and people are not good at folding overpairs in small stakes. And a lot of people wont event think about additional value behind them, they will either slowplay their nuts, because its nuts [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] or not.

But your point about slowplaying makes perfect sense here, i tend to agree that most of the people will slowplay it.

notevenhere · #8 06-28-2006, 03:23 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, I think the best line is to flat call the flop. CO is probably folding to any more aggression BUT might see my raise as an attempt to isolate the short stack.

I think the goal here is to find a line that extracts most from the CO.

Another question: Are you folding if CO raises after you flat call? The more I Think about the more I think there is no way we can fold this hand. If I just call I have not shown any strenght in this hand (c-betting followed by call). He may think any PP is good here.

Also, Why would CO: A. raise originally when he flopped top full house and there is still someone to act behind him, and B. then raise it again after a shorty goes all in (part B is speaking hypothetically? I think there is no way we can put CO on 44...given the action thus far. So, I think our focus becomes value.

Any other thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

On many sites, CO cannot raise your call, since the All-In by the button was not enough to qualify as another raise. Would have had to be at least All-In of $20.

Your assessment of the CO not having the 44 may be spot on. But I am not sure this means we can get more value from the CO. If the next card that falls is higher than his PP, and is a card he considers to be in your range, he will shut it down.

RIDGE45 · #9 06-28-2006, 03:25 AM

[ QUOTE ]
On many sites, CO cannot raise your call, since the All-In by the button was not enough to qualify as another raise. Would have had to be at least All-In of $20.

Your assessment of the CO not having the 44 may be spot on. But I am not sure this means we can get more value from the CO. If the next card that falls is higher than his PP, and is a card he considers to be in your range, he will shut it down.

[/ QUOTE ]

So, do you advocate raising the short stacks all-in? If so how much? A push, a smaller raise (1/2-3/4 pot)?

notevenhere · #10 06-28-2006, 03:42 AM

I think my line is to call the All-In, then try to go to showdown as cheaply as possible. I don't need to stack the CO if I have him beat. The main pot is big enough here that I am just happy to win that amount of $. If an Ace happens to fall, then all you can eat baby.