religion and faith (also long) - Page 7

MidGe · #61 06-08-2006, 07:50 AM

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If I were god, I am not sure how I would justly deal with the recalcitrantly evil, assuming that there is no such thing as extinction, and all are eternal.

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Just use a bit of imagination and cretivity. As I said elsewhere, give them a second chance.

To me, christianity, in general, and I do know of a few exception and those are not mainstream, perpetuates the deception, that Orwellian double talk, that equates "love" with a sadism that the marquis himself was incapable of conceiving.

pilliwinks · #62 06-08-2006, 07:54 AM

WRT your comment on foxholes I totally agree. Nothing less convincing than a frightened person praying 'god, if there is a god, save me and I promise to be good'! I was by no means praising or recommending this kind of 'conversion'.

Personally, I suspect that 'multiple tries' is not an option: I am no expert on what persists after death, but I suspect it is not transferable to babies.

If it were, I am not sure this would be desirable. Bear in mind that as god you know how much damage that person is going to do in their next how ever many tries. Real people have to suffer for your well-intentioned reform plan. Isn't that like refraining from imprisoning violent criminals on the basis that they'll learn the error of their ways sooner or later? That is benevolent only in a rather perverse and focussed way!

chezlaw · #63 06-08-2006, 07:55 AM

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I don't think that's right. If I find the bible to be nothing to do with god (which is the case) its still the case if its true and describes a god that would condemn me to eternal damnantion for making an honest mistake, then that god isn't benevolent.

chez

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Um, I don't think you can have a bible which is both true and nothing to do with god, but let that pass

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No, but you can have a bible that many honestly believe to be nothing to do with god, yet is to do with god.

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I think I mentioned that there are people who think that God, having made everything, is perfectly entitled to bin whichever of his toys displease him after he has made them.

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This from your other post. god can do whatever he likes but if he behaves unbenevelently then he is not benevelent.

As to the rest of your posts, I agree. I don't think the christian god would condemn anyone for not believing in him. Its just nasty strain of christianity that demeens god so.

chez

godBoy · #64 06-08-2006, 07:56 AM

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If I were god, I am not sure how I would justly deal with the recalcitrantly evil, assuming that there is no such thing as extinction, and all are eternal.

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It's clearly ignorance to the true nature of God that is making people here think they could make better choices than God Himself..

I see your stance here much more fitting - one simply that says "I'm not big enough to make those decisions".

MidGe · #65 06-08-2006, 07:59 AM

Back godboy!

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It's clearly ignorance to the true nature of God that is making people here think they could make better choices than God Himself..

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Yep, to me, the kind of ignorance invoked by many Germans under Hitler...

pilliwinks · #66 06-08-2006, 08:19 AM

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As to the rest of your posts, I agree. I don't think the christian god would condemn anyone for not believing in him. Its just nasty strain of christianity that demeens god so.

chez

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Hmm. Not sure I go quite that far. I guess it depends what you mean by 'not believing in him'. The bible is explicit and consistent about the fact that some kind of judgement and potential punishment are coming. Thankfully we are not in a position to do the judging, and all we know is that those who actually trust God (regardless of what they say) will be fine.

chezlaw · #67 06-08-2006, 08:30 AM

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As to the rest of your posts, I agree. I don't think the christian god would condemn anyone for not believing in him. Its just nasty strain of christianity that demeens god so.

chez

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Hmm. Not sure I go quite that far. I guess it depends what you mean by 'not believing in him'. The bible is explicit and consistent about the fact that some kind of judgement and potential punishment are coming. Thankfully we are not in a position to do the judging, and all we know is that those who actually trust God (regardless of what they say) will be fine.

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In that case, I disagree with you. He created many of us unable to believe in him and if he damns us for it then he is not benevlent.

and if his not benevelent then you have no reason to believe that you can trust his word even if the bible is his word.

chez

pilliwinks · #68 06-08-2006, 09:19 AM

I am not sure how you can tell that you are unable to believe in him. I can tell that I currently do not believe in Krishna, but I am by no means sure that I am unable to.

chezlaw · #69 06-08-2006, 09:28 AM

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I am not sure how you can tell that you are unable to believe in him. I can tell that I currently do not believe in Krishna, but I am by no means sure that I am unable to.

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Letc check the logic first. If its true that I'm unable to believe in him then do you agree the rest follows?

chez

Sephus · #70 06-08-2006, 09:53 AM

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I am not sure how you can tell that you are unable to believe in him. I can tell that I currently do not believe in Krishna, but I am by no means sure that I am unable to.

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Letc check the logic first. If its true that I'm unable to believe in him then do you agree the rest follows?

chez

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i think it's possible that our inability to believe is a result of choices we've freely made in the past.

i dont want to argue about how likley that is, i just think it's conceivable that our inability to believe could be our own "fault" and not god's.