When to call min-raises from the blinds?

[Wish]

I play in low buy in tournaments, and the play is pretty bad. (I'm not that good yet either, so that's OK with me.) My question is about a situation that comes up a lot in these sorts of events.

I'm in the big blind. Somebody around the HJ or CO seat minraises, and either one or two folks call before it gets to me. Assuming unknown villains, can somebody help me out with proper calling ranges for different situations?

My instinct is that deep-stacked (usually early in a tourney), I should treat this like any other poker game can call any two if the pot is laying me 7:1 odds. I'm not as sure about the one-caller 5:1 or no caller 3.5:1 situations. I'm also not at all clear as to whether that decision changes as the stacks get shorter (say I've got M~7 or M~15).

I'm looking for advice on when/if I should be calling with relative trash here. If I've got a premium hand, I'll be reraising.

[Pokerfarian]

Examples are generally better than general questions.
Generally relative trash should just be folded, with shorter stacks hands like 64s also become more likely to be folded. Hand's like 72o should be folded even super deep imo.

[Wish]

OK. If I get a chance this weekend, I'll dig around in my hand histories and see if I can find some good examples to post for more specific responses.

[crankalicious]

Obviously, there will be a lot of differing opinions on this subject and there are such a wide variety of possibilities that a general answer probably won't do much good, but I'll try anyway.

I would say, first, that there's a big difference between having one min-raise in front of you and having more than one. You should be extremely cautious entering a multi-way pot like that. If you're considering it, then you should raise and try to drive some people out of that pot.

Even if you have only one min-raise in front of you, you should be very cautious since you're out of position after the flop.

Frankly, this is a situation I often toy with. For instance, you're in the big blind with 4 min-raises in front of you. If you raise 4BB how many times will the 4 min-raisers fold? 5BB? Etc.

The possibilities are endless. However, I would suggest that if you think about that situation more as an information gathering exercise, it might pay more dividends. It also might benefit you down the road as the blinds increase. In other words, if you raise a few times, then perhaps players are more cautious about trying to steal your blinds later on. In fact, you might be able to create that perception at a fairly cheap price by only doubling the bet. If the people in front of you know that everytime you're in the BB, you're apt to double the bet, they stop limping.

My feeling about it in general is that limping in tends to get me in trouble because when I hit part of the flop and bet, I'm out of position, and often find myself unable to get away from the hand.

[BrandiFan]

I almost never fold with more than 15 or so BBs, but then again I am an arrogant bastard and I think I can outplay everyone after the flop. Depending on the situation, I can be VERY protective of my BB.
Edit: To answer your question, it should be a function of how confident you are of your postflop play. Keep in mind that there's alot of value in having your opponents afraid to raise your blind in later stages.

[Sherman]

I usually fold if at least one other person called and I have to play the hand OOP against two people. If I have something that is connected, suited, or playable, I will call though.

If someone in MP or LP min-raises and it folds to me and I am in the BB, I call with a pretty wide range of hands. The pot odds are often too good just to try and hit the flop (and check/fold otherwise). Especially with antes in play. Plus, I figure to win a few pots that I don't hit the flop on. Making it overall +EV to call against one opponent with nearly ATC.

[Kimbell175113]

Yeah, more people means better odds, but that is at least cancelled out by the fact that you need a much stronger hand to win and you have a much smaller chance of bluffing successfully. Sherman's advice is good, as always.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is relative position. If the minraiser is in early-ish position, and there are callers behind, that is good for you because you can check the flop, he'll bet, and you get to see what everyone else does before deciding what to do. This helps your marginal high-card hands like KJ more than it does suited or connected stuff.

If, however, PF was limp limp minraise and a bunch of calls, that's bad. When it checks to the raiser and he bets, you will be sandwiched, so you better have either a big hand or nothing.

[Sherman]

Good point Kimbell.

[ QUOTE ]
Generally relative trash should just be folded, with shorter stacks hands like 64s also become more likely to be folded.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is another good point. Stack depth. The deeper stack I have, the more willing I am to calling with ATC b/c my implied odds can be huge. With shallower stacks, I will even let some playable hands go from the BB to a min-raise.

[Wish]

Thanks guys, I'm reading all of this and trying to put it together. There are clearly a lot of angles to this that I didn't even know enough to consider, and I do appreciate the replies and the chance to learn something.

[wheels25]

[ QUOTE ]
I almost never fold with more than 15 or so BBs, but then again I am an arrogant bastard and I think I can outplay everyone after the flop. Depending on the situation, I can be VERY protective of my BB.
Edit: To answer your question, it should be a function of how confident you are of your postflop play. Keep in mind that there's alot of value in having your opponents afraid to raise your blind in later stages.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol, how do you outplay those guys in low buyin tourneys...
Do you guess they fold their bottom pair on the flop if you checkraise them in order to outplay them on turn on river? Good luck.