Belgariad game thread

[traz]

On the issue of asharak outting himself, I have already told the mods that I disagree with their version of outing himself. It seemed to me that the whole point was that the baddies were supposed to have to guess who he is, and not get clues from him. Him voting with them is just as clear as saying I'M ASHARAK without the words, however they don't see it that way. Like I said, I've already mentioned this, so we'll agree to disagree [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

If the baddies kill me today, and then mand at night, I think they might still win even if MDD votes with us today. I realise its dumb to say this as it might persuade mdd to vote with them, but meh.

[SynSid]

[ QUOTE ]
Not true, I thought about this. With Gorion activated and MDD swinging to the good side, we will have room to mess up. With synsid coming out as the 9th(!) villager, we now have our last 2 bad guys among amplify, boiler, and synsid. We can afford one screwup.

Village is in autowin if we win the coinflip today; definitely.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think the situation is as clearcut as you seem to imply. I'm pretty sure there's more unverified villagers than just the three you named - not least of which is MDD himself.

I'm sitting here trying to work out why they haven't killed Traz yet. If I were a badguy AND MDD is errand then I'd have dumped brill on Traz soon as this argument started - so he knew he no longer had an option of winning with the village. Why haven't they? The folowing possibilities suggest themselves:

1. The real errand is someone other than MDD - either someone who said they were a villager but wouldn't vote with the badguys.
2. Brill's an UNIDed badguy - and they want a commitment from MDD before going for it.
3. MDD's a legit badguy not errand. Bit of an FPS move but if MDD refuses to work with the badguys - or says he will then reneges after brill moves on Traz - then would that put him above suspicion for the rest of the game?

Something just doesn't sit right with me with this whole scenario.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
On the issue of asharak outting himself, I have already told the mods that I disagree with their version of outing himself. It seemed to me that the whole point was that the baddies were supposed to have to guess who he is, and not get clues from him. Him voting with them is just as clear as saying I'M ASHARAK without the words, however they don't see it that way. Like I said, I've already mentioned this, so we'll agree to disagree [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

If the baddies kill me today, and then mand at night, I think they might still win even if MDD votes with us today. I realise its dumb to say this as it might persuade mdd to vote with them, but meh.

[/ QUOTE ]

*** NOT A PLAYER ***

In my opinion if Asharak votes Mandalloren now then he has revealed himself to the bad guys, whichk means he is revealed.

*** NOT A PLAYER ***

Edit: I'm not a game mod my opinion is meaningless here final decision is up to VR and JaredL

[Iron_Yuppie]

[ QUOTE ]
On the issue of asharak outting himself, I have already told the mods that I disagree with their version of outing himself. It seemed to me that the whole point was that the baddies were supposed to have to guess who he is, and not get clues from him. Him voting with them is just as clear as saying I'M ASHARAK without the words, however they don't see it that way. Like I said, I've already mentioned this, so we'll agree to disagree [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with you (of course), the rules say the power can't be "exercised openly" but it sure sounds like that is what is being done here, the person exercising the power will be known to be evil.

[ QUOTE ]
If the baddies kill me today, and then mand at night, I think they might still win even if MDD votes with us today. I realise its dumb to say this as it might persuade mdd to vote with them, but meh.

[/ QUOTE ]

All this will do is reduce the game to another coin-flip, as the Mand kill is not assured. If the bad guys win, Errand gets the evil win condition. If the good guys win, Errand controls the fate of the game.

[SynSid]

[ QUOTE ]
*** NOT A PLAYER ***

In my opinion if Asharak votes Mandalloren now then he has revealed himself to the bad guys, whichk means he is revealed.

*** NOT A PLAYER ***

[/ QUOTE ]

That's how I understood it too - but apparently the Mods have clarified to the bad guys (presuably including Asharak) that isn't the case and their "in the open" approach is, to an extent at least, based on this rule clarification.

At root I think there's a conflict here between player-knowledge and character-knowledge. In a more role-playkng tended version of the game characters couldn't discuss in-thread knowledge which the player possesses but the character doesn't - and hence noone other than Asharak would be able to post or act based on knowledge of his existence.

[Iron_Yuppie]

BTW, Jared, VR, please don't take my critique badly; I think you guys are doing an excellent job and appreciaite your hard work in creating such a rich, complex, and fun game. It is only natural in a game this complicated that we will have a few "quibbles."

[Nicholasp27]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not true, I thought about this. With Gorion activated and MDD swinging to the good side, we will have room to mess up. With synsid coming out as the 9th(!) villager, we now have our last 2 bad guys among amplify, boiler, and synsid. We can afford one screwup.

Village is in autowin if we win the coinflip today; definitely.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think the situation is as clearcut as you seem to imply. I'm pretty sure there's more unverified villagers than just the three you named - not least of which is MDD himself.

I'm sitting here trying to work out why they haven't killed Traz yet. If I were a badguy AND MDD is errand then I'd have dumped brill on Traz soon as this argument started - so he knew he no longer had an option of winning with the village. Why haven't they? The folowing possibilities suggest themselves:

1. The real errand is someone other than MDD - either someone who said they were a villager but wouldn't vote with the badguys.
2. Brill's an UNIDed badguy - and they want a commitment from MDD before going for it.
3. MDD's a legit badguy not errand. Bit of an FPS move but if MDD refuses to work with the badguys - or says he will then reneges after brill moves on Traz - then would that put him above suspicion for the rest of the game?

Something just doesn't sit right with me with this whole scenario.

[/ QUOTE ]

quoted for emphasis

[Iron_Yuppie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not true, I thought about this. With Gorion activated and MDD swinging to the good side, we will have room to mess up. With synsid coming out as the 9th(!) villager, we now have our last 2 bad guys among amplify, boiler, and synsid. We can afford one screwup.

Village is in autowin if we win the coinflip today; definitely.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think the situation is as clearcut as you seem to imply. I'm pretty sure there's more unverified villagers than just the three you named - not least of which is MDD himself.

I'm sitting here trying to work out why they haven't killed Traz yet. If I were a badguy AND MDD is errand then I'd have dumped brill on Traz soon as this argument started - so he knew he no longer had an option of winning with the village. Why haven't they? The folowing possibilities suggest themselves:

1. The real errand is someone other than MDD - either someone who said they were a villager but wouldn't vote with the badguys.
2. Brill's an UNIDed badguy - and they want a commitment from MDD before going for it.
3. MDD's a legit badguy not errand. Bit of an FPS move but if MDD refuses to work with the badguys - or says he will then reneges after brill moves on Traz - then would that put him above suspicion for the rest of the game?

Something just doesn't sit right with me with this whole scenario.

[/ QUOTE ]

MDD can't be a bad guy, the whole reason the bad guys did this was because they needed another vote, and they won't get that with MDD.

The bad guys could certainly be lying about MDD, but I don't know what we can do about it.

[ QUOTE ]
2. Brill's an UNIDed badguy - and they want a commitment from MDD before going for it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know quite what this means; brill is Jonsan, as confirmd by traz (and backed up by Jonsan)

[SynSid]

[ QUOTE ]
]2. Brill's an UNIDed badguy - and they want a commitment from MDD before going for it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know quite what this means; brill is Jonsan, as confirmd by traz (and backed up by Jonsan)

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, I somehow managed to miss that.

[JaredL]

Mod Request

I would like to put in a request that we stop discussing, or at least keep it to a minimum, whether or not the rules are fair and/or the game is balanced. You may not like the rules, we may not like the rules, random observers may not like the rules but we're not going to change them in the middle of the game especially after we clarified them to several players in private and that may have altered their strategies.

VR and I have been discussing the rules at great length outside the thread. We have decided on some changes and are planning on running the game again whenever the next available long game timeslot opens (probably after mish-mash).

Feel free to send us any comments outside the thread or make comments after the game ends. In this thread while the game is going let's try to just keep the focus on playing the game.

Thank you.

Jared