Razz: was the reraise correct or should I let the high cards play?

[betgo]

Razz ($15/$30), Ante $3, Bring-In $5 (converter)

3rd Street - (1.20 SB)

Hero: A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 3: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 4: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___folds
Seat 5: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___completes___calls
Seat 8: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds

[Wetdog]

I don't like the raise. While the high cards might not call a complete, the most likely won't call a reraise. Loose players need some reason to throw their money away. Don't take it away from them.

[grapes]

This is fairly close. If there's a real chance that one (or both?!) of the higher cards will call both bets, then a reraise is clearly correct. It's hard to imagine they would, especially considering it could end up capped, but then it's also hard to see how they could limp in in the first place.

The completer probably isn't stealing here after limpers, but he could have as bad as a 9 or T. If he would have completed with any three cards, reraising and getting him heads up is reasonable.

Usually, I think I'd rather play 4-handed for 1 bet than heads up with a small edge for a double bet, even considering the dead money in the pot if you shut out the limpers. Players who limp and then call raises with paint are likely to call down and pay off a string of big bets with little chance if you catch good.

[HOWMANY]

This is fine, I've had people get jammed in there with a T/J door against two lows on third before in these games, I'd give them the chance to make that mistake.

If they're for sure folding to the 2 bets then I'd just call but in my experience a lot of these retards aren't folding before 5th street if they've put anything into the pot already.

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
This is fine, I've had people get jammed in there with a T/J door against two lows on third before in these games, I'd give them the chance to make that mistake.

If they're for sure folding to the 2 bets then I'd just call but in my experience a lot of these retards aren't folding before 5th street if they've put anything into the pot already.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is 15/30 and I assumed that both high card limpers would definately fold to two raises and maybe fold to one raise. I also assumed they both had two wheel cards in the hole. That is I assumed they were playing somewhat rationally. Rather than assuming they would give action if I caught good, I was concerned that it would be hard to win the hand 4-way.

Based on this discussion, maybe it would have been better to let them in and let everyone think maybe my hand was weaker than it was.

[HOWMANY]

If someone enters the pot with a T/J I have no idea why you'd assume they were thinking rationally. When I say I have people get jammed in here I don't mean some play money .5/1 retard, I mean I've had it happen repeatedly in my limited Stars/FTP 15/30-30/60 experience. There are a lot of people that really just don't like their money at all.

I guess with this additional info calling is probably right, it makes 4th sort of tough though, and I can see it resulting in a multiway jam between 3-4 three card hands regardless of whether we try to get it HU on 4th with the other good hand or if we peel and a retard raises behind us.

FWIW I'm positive I would raise like you did, in games I'm just decent at I try to push the easiest edges, possibly passing up some tiny edges along the way. I only push the tiny edges in games where I am actually good at exploiting those edges, Razz is not one of them for me.

[Andy B]

I'd certainly raise. It can't be far wrong. If these guys limped in early with garbage, why can't they call another $25?

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd certainly raise. It can't be far wrong. If these guys limped in early with garbage, why can't they call another $25?

[/ QUOTE ]
I was absolutely sure they would not call two raises and might not both call one raise. They were not that bad. A27 is 65% against A2T HU and 68% against A2J. Perhaps, I should let them in cheaply and hope they make further mistakes, but there is a good chance they draw out on me.

[Jigsaws]

I like letting them in. I think they'll often make huge mistakes post-3rd street. In my experience, once they are in with the high card, they'll never fold if they catch okay twice - e.g. if all three of you catch a 3 and an 8 you'll have about ~50% equity against an A2J and an A2T.