Is Neo-Atheism The Way to Go? [Poll]

[soon2bepro]

We'll never get rid of this virus/fantasy until we start treating it as what it is.

[bunny]

I think this thread is confusing religious belief with religious people. Those arguing for mockery are focussing on the silly beliefs, those arguing for civility are focussing on the people holding them.

I think you should respect me and mock my silly beliefs. (As an aside, I reject the claim that religious belief entails certainty, but concede that most believers say it does. In my opinion, the real problem stems from being sure your mystical beliefs are correct, not from the fact that you have them).

[madnak]

[ QUOTE ]
I think this thread is confusing religious belief with religious people. Those arguing for mockery are focussing on the silly beliefs, those arguing for civility are focussing on the people holding them.

I think you should respect me and mock my silly beliefs. (As an aside, I reject the claim that religious belief entails certainty, but concede that most believers say it does. In my opinion, the real problem stems from being sure your mystical beliefs are correct, not from the fact that you have them).

[/ QUOTE ]

There's also the hidden issue we've avoided so far. But it has to come up. That's the issue of proselytism.

Are we justified in doing whatever it takes to spread atheism? If so, then aren't the theists equally justified in doing whatever it takes to spread their beliefs? It's not just the specific tactics that matter, but the general approach. Attacking the logic of theistic beliefs is one thing, but getting into more general mockery treads awfully close to hypocrisy.

Most of all, I don't think our hatred of or disdain for religion should override the principle of "live and let live." I think this is really where some atheists go off track.

[luckyme]

[ QUOTE ]
If so, then aren't the theists equally justified in doing whatever it takes to spread their beliefs?

[/ QUOTE ]

My neighbor is an atheist.
Please list his beliefs.

luckyme

[madnak]

It's a valid distinction in terms of philosophy, but I'm not buying it in terms of practice.

[luckyme]

[ QUOTE ]
I think this thread is confusing religious belief with religious people. Those arguing for mockery are focussing on the silly beliefs, those arguing for civility are focussing on the people holding them.

I think you should respect me and mock my silly beliefs (As an aside, I reject the claim that religious belief entails certainty, but concede that most believers say it does. In my opinion, the real problem stems from being sure your mystical beliefs are correct, not from the fact that you have them).

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you making a distinction between "that's laughable" and "you're laughable for believing that"?
"that's loud". "you're a loud person".
"that a lot of fat." "you're a fat person".
"that's a racist comment". " you're a racist ( because you believe that)".

"Fritzig tells some funny jokes ... gawd, he's funny".

Sure, we can pretend the ideas a person has are nailed to their door in the middle of the night and they're just forced to recite them, or we can recognize that we are what we do/are, as above.

That was the gist of my wanting to keep my respect respectable. I want my kids, friends and coworkers to be able to trust my opinion and not have to worry that I can think thoughts such as " he's an honest man, he just lies a lot"

Not to be confused with respecting their right to believe in ufo's, heck, I may drive them to the landing spot if they're stuck for a ride. Perhaps that's somewhat along the line you're taking.

luckyme

[Subfallen]

Maybe one or two people in this thread understand the profound damage religious fundamentalists do to their children.

Fundamentalist religion is poison, pure and simple. So, yes, we need more neo-atheists, if only [Daily Show]for the children.[/Daily Show]

[Alex-db]

We should treat people with traditional religious beliefs in the same way we treat people with traditional racist beliefs.

That doesn't exclude being civil, but it does include being vocal and proactively intolerant.

Does anyone argue that it is uncivil to promote neo-a-racism in the deep south?

[Lestat]

[ QUOTE ]
We should treat people with traditional religious beliefs in the same way we treat people with traditional racist beliefs.

That doesn't exclude being civil, but it does include being vocal and proactively intolerant.

Does anyone argue that it is uncivil to promote neo-a-racism in the deep south?

[/ QUOTE ]

Alex, you've hit upon the key word that for some reason escaped me in this thread. "Intolerant". We should be intolerant to stupid beliefs without fear of hurting someone's sensibilities.

[VarlosZ]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe one or two people in this thread understand the profound damage religious fundamentalists do to their children.

Fundamentalist religion is poison, pure and simple. So, yes, we need more neo-atheists. . .

[/ QUOTE ]

But your conclusion only follows if scorn is better at convincing people than civility. That seems very unlikely to me.