P5's top donk-n-go player is going pro (modnote: Awesome hand inside)

[cowpig]

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ok but A8s OTB with an early position limper fish is like the nuts

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No, it's actually not.

I'd fold that as a fairly standard thing.
Your equity at the start of a 10-handed SNG is 1/10th (obviously)

However, if, on the first hand, you bust someone out and take their chips, your equity does not double. This essentially a function of the payout structure. Incidentally, the same thing happens in a MTT, but because the final table is so far away typically, it's not so pronounced.

There's some mathematics on here somewhere which shows that you need around a 55:45 edge when flipping for stacks for it to be even neutral EV.

While, of course, you're not flipping for stacks here, you are increasing the chance of a showdown by playing the hand. Thus, you need more than it to just be +cEV.



I think I have a VPIP of around 5-7% for the first couple of levels in SNGs. This is not particularly unusual amongst winning players.

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You are decreasing your ROI by folding in +EV spots. Your chips don't decrease in value THAT much.

[Slim Pickens]

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ok but A8s OTB with an early position limper fish is like the nuts

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No, it's actually not.

I'd fold that as a fairly standard thing.
Your equity at the start of a 10-handed SNG is 1/10th (obviously)

However, if, on the first hand, you bust someone out and take their chips, your equity does not double. This essentially a function of the payout structure. Incidentally, the same thing happens in a MTT, but because the final table is so far away typically, it's not so pronounced.

There's some mathematics on here somewhere which shows that you need around a 55:45 edge when flipping for stacks for it to be even neutral EV.

While, of course, you're not flipping for stacks here, you are increasing the chance of a showdown by playing the hand. Thus, you need more than it to just be +cEV.



I think I have a VPIP of around 5-7% for the first couple of levels in SNGs. This is not particularly unusual amongst winning players.

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You are decreasing your ROI by folding in +EV spots. Your chips don't decrease in value THAT much.

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Stop! You're making baby SNGee-sus cry!

[Josem]

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You are decreasing your ROI by folding in +EV spots.

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While I recognise that this wasn't supposed to be a wide ranging sentence, it actually belies a lack of understanding of a whole series of issues:

1) I think you may be confusing two issues here - cEV vs $EV. They are very different things.

2) There are many spots where you would want to fold +$EV spots, because it encourages other players to clash (which is even more +$EV)

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Your chips don't decrease in value THAT much.

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Yes, they actually do. This is the whole premise of highly skilled SNG play.

This is why the best SNG players are the best SNG plyers. They recognise and understand the difference between cEV and $EV, and recognise how to react.

[jonkeponke]

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Blackize, I'm not sure what's more ridiculous, the post you just made, or the one about the "horrid 3-bet" a few months ago, which was a hand that I played perfectly. in any event if you think that I'm not 10% in the $12s you just arent paying attention, or you just don't understand the game that well.

Username Games Played Av. Profit Av. Stake Av. ROI Total Profit Form Network Filter
PunkinBear 363 $4 $17 31% $1,401 Hot FullTilt E9-9 x
PunkinBear 354 $8 $18 35% $2,890 - PokerStars E9-9 x


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So um, just one question. How do you play essentially the same # of SNGs, with close to the same ROI & Avg. buyin, yet have 2x the profit on one site? The slight differences in ROI, Avg. Buyin, and total played can't account for a 100% difference. You claimed these were all one-tables, but thats impossible looking at these.

[TheNoodleMan]

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ok but A8s OTB with an early position limper fish is like the nuts

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No, it's actually not.

I'd fold that as a fairly standard thing.
Your equity at the start of a 10-handed SNG is 1/10th (obviously)

However, if, on the first hand, you bust someone out and take their chips, your equity does not double. This essentially a function of the payout structure. Incidentally, the same thing happens in a MTT, but because the final table is so far away typically, it's not so pronounced.

There's some mathematics on here somewhere which shows that you need around a 55:45 edge when flipping for stacks for it to be even neutral EV.

While, of course, you're not flipping for stacks here, you are increasing the chance of a showdown by playing the hand. Thus, you need more than it to just be +cEV.



I think I have a VPIP of around 5-7% for the first couple of levels in SNGs. This is not particularly unusual amongst winning players.

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You are decreasing your ROI by folding in +EV spots. Your chips don't decrease in value THAT much.

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Yes they do.

One of the great paradoxes of 2+2 is that cash game players ridicule SNGs (and all tournaments) and say that they aren't poker, yet they are always ready to put cash poker analysis to a tourney hand.

[jmill2511]

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One of the great paradoxes of 2+2 is that cash game players ridicule SNGs (and all tournaments) and say that they aren't poker, yet they are always ready to put cash poker analysis to a tourney hand.

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Stop being so rational.

[blackize]

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Username Games Played Av. Profit Av. Stake Av. ROI Total Profit Form Network Filter
PunkinBear 363 $4 $17 31% $1,401 Hot FullTilt E9-9 x
PunkinBear 354 $8 $18 35% $2,890 - PokerStars E9-9 x

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So um, just one question. How do you play essentially the same # of SNGs, with close to the same ROI & Avg. buyin, yet have 2x the profit on one site? The slight differences in ROI, Avg. Buyin, and total played can't account for a 100% difference. You claimed these were all one-tables, but thats impossible looking at these.

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Those are from sharkscope. Sharkscope is very weird in how it handles certain things.

For example $17 * 363 * .31 is 1900 profit. But her profit is 1400 over that stretch. A large discrepancy. And 18 * 354 * .35 is 2230. Considerably less than what sharkscope reports.

[blackize]

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Would she be getting all the haterz if she were 2p2 and a dude (honest question)?

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Yes.

[adanthar]

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Would she be getting all the haterz if she were 2p2 and a dude (honest question)?

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Yes.

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if she was a guy I would have been way harsher

actually, come to think of it, let me fix that

[TheNoodleMan]

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Would she be getting all the haterz if she were 2p2 and a dude (honest question)?

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Yes.

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The real question is would she have gotten all the p5 love if she was a dude.