Beat the UIGEA from the bottom up

[Tuff_Fish]

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Id send it sooner but the day job comes first.

Keep the ideas coming!

Skallagrim

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Day jobs are overrated.

But thanks.

Tuff

[DeadMoneyDad]

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But playability, have you ever tried going through 7 different lobbies at a time, looking for the game you need, only to find empty tables? You need it centralized. At least make all the servers report to a central lobby... [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Hence the rub.

A completely distributed platform might work for play chips but any real money games require some comonality and centrality. Then you have issues with security and functionality.

All are not oversurmountable issues IMO.

Working on it,


D$D

[DeadMoneyDad]

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Id send it sooner but the day job comes first.

Keep the ideas coming!

Skallagrim

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Day jobs are overrated.



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What are those? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]


D$D

[Grasshopp3r]

The method to support the site is donations. Think along the lines of tipping the dealer. There is massive cash flow if players are given the option to tip. Plus, you can run tourneys for whatever is taken in that exceeds expenses. Those that tip can play. How about that for elegant solution?

[Tuff_Fish]

[ QUOTE ]
The method to support the site is donations. Think along the lines of tipping the dealer. There is massive cash flow if players are given the option to tip. Plus, you can run tourneys for whatever is taken in that exceeds expenses. Those that tip can play. How about that for elegant solution?

[/ QUOTE ]

Those that tip can play.

Again, you are creating a "Pay for play" situation. I know it is a nitty position, but that is exactly what the opposing authorities will be searching for. You cannot have ANY requirements or conditions with regards to compensation in return for the privilege of playing.

Should an AG wish to bust the site, they will send somebody to play, and that person will refuse all requests for tips, donations, beer, anything. If, at any time, that person is denied the right to play on the site in any way, even special tournaments...., BUSTED.

So, whatever funding mechanism is conceived, it has to be completely voluntary. Then you get the old, "let somebody else pay while I play".

It is a tough problem. How do you deal with the freeloaders? If they don't tip, and a large number won't, you can't kick them off. It is different in a B&M. There is a not so subtle expectation that you tip, and if you consistantly refuse, everyone around you will call you a jerk and worse. You can certainly get away with not tipping, but your B&M trip will not be a pleasant one.

On the internet, nobody cares if they are called a jerk, even if they can't turn off the chat. If they are getting a free ride, they could care less.

Tuff

[tsearcher]

Would it be legal to offer a subscription service? You don't pay a rake or to play, just a monthly fee to log on. Or could you have a subscription service for something else (stock market info, news, music, porn, etc.) that offers poker as a free bonus?

[Tuff_Fish]

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Would it be legal to offer a subscription service? You don't pay a rake or to play, just a monthly fee to log on.

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Not legal, it is pay for play.
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Or could you have a subscription service for something else (stock market info, news, music, porn, etc.) that offers poker as a free bonus?
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If the right to play is conditional in any way to the purchase of something else..., Illegal. .
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Even selling food and drink in the same proximity as a poker game, ie, having a poker game in the back room of your bar, has been ruled illegal in a number of cases. Even though the purchase of said food and drink is completely voluntary, and you would never be asked to leave if you did not partake.

Again, the actual law may vary, and it is totally lame, but authorities have had a decent track record when they have chosen to push the issue.

TF

[_dave_]

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Even selling food and drink in the same proximity as a poker game, ie, having a poker game in the back room of your bar, has been ruled illegal in a number of cases. Even though the purchase of said food and drink is completely voluntary, and you would never be asked to leave if you did not partake.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, that scuppers a lot of the potential ideas I was thinking about [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

I was just pondering the idea of free-to-play, but one could purchase "value-added" services if so desired. I guess that's a no-go now [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Looks like the tip-the-dealer model is the most legally viable view... which makes me think:

[ QUOTE ]

It is a tough problem. How do you deal with the freeloaders? If they don't tip, and a large number won't, you can't kick them off. It is different in a B&M. There is a not so subtle expectation that you tip, and if you consistantly refuse, everyone around you will call you a jerk and worse. You can certainly get away with not tipping, but your B&M trip will not be a pleasant one.

On the internet, nobody cares if they are called a jerk, even if they can't turn off the chat. If they are getting a free ride, they could care less.


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Are you so sure?

What if people had a "rating" visible to other players, indicating how much of a baller/freeloader they were? What if requirements for the game were - not as touted - multiple / frequent name changes, but that you could only ever play under your *real*, verified name and location?

I'd imagine people would be far less apt to behave like an antisocial git if it was their real identity at stake [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

lol, just ideas.

dave.

[Grasshopp3r]

Well, the cost of providing the service is incrementally low for each new table, so I don't see freeloaders as a problem.

[DeadMoneyDad]

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Well, the cost of providing the service is incrementally low for each new table, so I don't see freeloaders as a problem.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes but the first few are a real problem.

I may have a solution I'm working on, we'll see. I missed a call today with an update on the legal prospects.

But it really follows Tuff's dream of getting on-line US poker without trying to make a massive killing. Of course there will be a little profit but most of that is pretty much given away to attract the necessary parts.

If this flys thank Tuff for his dream and inspiration!

Imagine there's no UIGEA
It's easy if you try
No e-pass below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the poker
Playing for today

Imagine there's no countries laws
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to gain or fight for
And no rake too
Imagine all the people
Playing poker in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will play as one

Imagine no affiliates
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or scandal
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one


Sorry John!

(Lennon)


D$D