Vegas Trip Report (longish)

[tipperdog]

Just got back from Las Vegas…my official “taking a shot” at 15-30 trip. Several hands to question/report, but those will be posted in the appropriate forum section.

Stayed at the Venetian, which is nice but expensive. I did not take the poker rate, which was a good thing because they basically close the poker room for several hours each day during their “deep stack” tournaments. This would have made it difficult to play the requisite number of hours. However, I didn’t really mind paying more because I didn’t want to be tied down to any location. And a hint for anyone staying at the Venetian: do NOT stay in the “upgraded” Venezia tower. It’s a 10-15 minute walk to get anywhere in the hotel. Just stay in the main section.

I played my first-ever 15-30 hands at the Bellagio on Friday. My very first hand at this limit: I have KK in the BB. 3 limpers, MP raiser, I 3 bet and we get multiple callers for 3 bets each. Flop comes K45 and I don’t get much post-flop action, but it’s a big pot anyway. My second hand. I have A3 in the SB. Two limpers and I complete. Flop comes K73 and I bet and get raised by the BB. I call, planning to check-fold the turn unimproved. I turn a 3 and win a good pot. This game is easy [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

My brother and I have a nice dinner at the Venetian’s Zeffrinos, which overlooks the “grand canal” in the Venetian. It’s good. I have a first-course pasta with porcini mushrooms in a black truffle sauce that absolutely rocks. A main course fish dish is good, but nothing special. No wine, because I’m off to play some more!

I sit in the only 15-30 game at the Venetian and it may be the worst game I’ve ever seen. A bunch of surly tight locals and one loud drunk. It’s really unpleasant, and I don’t think it could be very profitable. I came here to play 15/30, but this isn’t any fun. I get on the 9/18 list and play with a bunch of fun tourists and do quite well. I sleep.

The next morning, we breakfast at the yummy Wynn buffet. I eat a fairly decent breakfast. My brother is determined to get full value from “all you can eat” and consumes four enormous helpings. The sight is at once revolting and impressive. After breakfast, there is only one 15/30 game going at the Wynn, so I get on that list and 2/5 NL as well. The 15 list is long and I get called for NL first.

The table is pretty good. I’m down slightly when, in the BB with a live straddle, I call the straddle with 56o. I lead at the A34 pot and get one caller. The turn 2 gives me the nuts, and my opponent calls pot sized bets on the turn and river. Yum!

But I came here to play limit and I leave the game when my seat at 15/30 opens. That was a HUGE mistake. In rapid succession, I lose the following hands:

I have AK OTB and 3-bet an MP raiser. The flop comes AA9. He had 99.
I call the SB with 44 and flop a set on a K-high board. My opponent calls flop and turn bets with 88 and rivers the 2-outer.
I have AJ on AJT flop. My opponent had KQ.

I played the above hands fine, but the loss sends on monkey tilt and I piss away several bets with foolish bluffs and loose calls. I take a beating this session and nearly erase the previous day’s gains. I decide to take a good break.

After several hours, I play some 15-30 at the Bellagio. While waiting for a seat, I recognize Roy Cooke and introduce myself. Roy is very kind and asks how I’ve been doing. I say (accurately) “I was playing really good, and then I played really bad.” Roy advises, “try to play good.” I should have listened.

I get in a great game with three fun-loving guys at a college frat reunion. They are having a wonderful time and playing badly. I get my share of their money when I flop top-two with Q9s in the BB and win a big pot. The three buddies leave to hit a strip club. I should get a table change or quit, but I stay despite the game’s deterioration. I turn my nice profit into a small one by playing too loosely from the blinds and running an absurd multi-street bluff into the tightest player at the table. I quit winners, but I played bad and I know it.

BTW, there was great “poker celebrity” sightings at the Bellagio. The “big game” was going with Doyle Brunson, Johnny Chan, Eli Elezra, Jennifer Harman, and some guy I recognized but couldn’t place. Phil Laak was playing 10-20 NL with Jennifer Tilly sitting in his lap. Sklansky was there, with Brandi in tow. I saw LA-based tournament player Shane 'Shaniac' Schleger, whose blog I enjoy very much. I chatted with him for a few minutes, and he seemed genuinely pleased that I read and enjoyed his writing. And I saw a wild 300/600 mixed game where it seemed the players were more interested in prop betting the flops than playing the game. Every flop, 1K chips would fly around the table amidst incoherent babble like “that’s my 2,” “all red plays double,” and similar.

I end the night with some 2-5 NL at the Venetian. I basically play two hands. I have KTh OTB against multiple limpers on a KhKs3s flop. I bet the flop and turn and pay off the MP player who slyly slowplayed AK. And, in an eerily similar hand, I have AQ OTB vs. multiple limpers on an AA3 flop. I stack a relatively short MP player who mucked, but I imagine had a lesser ace.

I am day 2 loser thanks to the Wynn disaster, but am still up decently for the trip. However, I’m very unhappy with my limit play. Tilty at the Wynn and just plain dumb at the Bellagio.

On Sunday, I pick up a few pots at a 15 game. Wiuth a few hours before my flight, I buy in short to a 2/5 NL game and get stacked with AK vs. AT on an ATx flop. I’m generally good about not getting stacked with one pair in NL, but because I was short, I’m not certain that I misplayed it.

I return home modest winners, but all-in-all, I’m not happy with how I played. I made numerous mistakes in the 15 game and was saved only by better-than-average luck. I take pride in not playing tilty, but I have to admit that the three brutal Wynn hands affected my play all day.

A few general observations about poker in Vegas:

1. The floor staff at the Bellagio is as rude as everyone says. Forget customer service; they can’t even handle common courtesy.
2. NL is dominating Vegas at a shocking rate. At the Venetian, for example, they had one 15-30 LHE game and eight 2/5 NL tables running. I do not think this is good for poker in the long run.
3. I was very surprised by the number of “pros” in the 15 game. I use this term loosely because they tend to play poorly. But I’d say half the players in the 15 game told me they played full time.
4. Game quality varies tremendously at 15-30 limit. I played in some fantastic games and some terrible ones. Game selection really comes into play here.
4. In the broadest terms, poker is alive and well in Vegas. All the rooms were crowded, almost all day long.

Golly that turned into a long post. Hope you enjoyed.

[PorkchopDJG]

Great Report.
I have played up to 10/20 LHE at the Mirage and am looking to move up to 15/30 next time in Vegas so I really enjoyed and appreciated the info.
If you had to say overall which 15/30 (Bellagio,Wynn,Venetain) did you;

A)like the best
B)think was overall the softest
C)think provided the most full games at that level

Thanks again

[tipperdog]

[ QUOTE ]
Great Report.
I have played up to 10/20 LHE at the Mirage and am looking to move up to 15/30 next time in Vegas so I really enjoyed and appreciated the info.
If you had to say overall which 15/30 (Bellagio,Wynn,Venetain) did you;

A)like the best
B)think was overall the softest
C)think provided the most full games at that level

Thanks again

[/ QUOTE ]

C. is the easiest to answer. Clearly the Bellagio, which usually had 3-5 15/30 games going. Wynn and Venetian had 0-3.

A (my favorite) is a tough question to answer. I hated the Wynn, but that's because I kept flopping 2nd nuts vs. nuts, and I don't think that's the casino's fault [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Room was comfortable; staff was nice. I like the electronic wait lists at V. and W. far more than the old clipboard at the B. As a tourist, I have to admit that I got a kick from watching the "Big Game" at the B. Room was cramped at the B and there's no place to sit while waiting to get called. And the staff was incredibly rude. Venetian was probably the nicest room of the bunch, but I hated that they closed the room to cash games during their tourney (The B moved tournies to the Fontana room). Also, game selection was worst at the V. I suppose my favorite was the B, simply because I won the most there.

B (softest games). Because of the game selection, it has to be the B., but I imagine it varies dramatically from day to day.

[that_pope]

Since you went during the WSOP (I assume), you actually got to see a game going at the Venetian (rare). Your choices during most of the year are Bellagio and Wynn. Bellagio is best choice for a game always going, but Wynn can usually get 2 started as well.

I am curious as to the 9/18 game you played at Venetian. I was not aware that limit was spread there, I thought they had 8/16 instead like Bellagio. The only 9/18 games I have heard about were in Cali.

Nice report, I also play 15/30 in Vegas when I go (when I am not drinking, then I donk away money at 2/5 NL).

[tipperdog]

[ QUOTE ]

I am curious as to the 9/18 game you played at Venetian. I was not aware that limit was spread there, I thought they had 8/16 instead like Bellagio. The only 9/18 games I have heard about were in Cali.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am certain that 9/18 is a regular game because they have $3 chips used only for that game.

I don't recall seeing 8/16 and I'd be surprised if it's ever spread since they're obviously committed to 9/18. Also, IMO, 9/18 is a better game due to the 2/3 blind structure.

[bravos1]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I am curious as to the 9/18 game you played at Venetian. I was not aware that limit was spread there, I thought they had 8/16 instead like Bellagio. The only 9/18 games I have heard about were in Cali.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am certain that 9/18 is a regular game because they have $3 chips used only for that game.

I don't recall seeing 8/16 and I'd be surprised if it's ever spread since they're obviously committed to 9/18. Also, IMO, 9/18 is a better game due to the 2/3 blind structure.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting... I was gonna ask the same thing. When I was there, they did not spread 9/18, but 8/16 instead. This game was just starting to be spread, and was using both $5 and $1 chips. I talked to the floor about the structure after he heard me commenting about it to an off duty dealer. He was very receptive to what I had to say.

[mattak]

[ QUOTE ]

2. NL is dominating Vegas at a shocking rate. At the Venetian, for example, they had one 15-30 LHE game and eight 2/5 NL tables running. I do not think this is good for poker in the long run.


[/ QUOTE ]

I am curious as to why NL is bad for the game in the long run. Possibly because the bad players lose their money faster? Most card rooms have a min/max buy in that limits the exposure for the average player. NL Holdem is by far the most played and popular game and the one that the casual player sees on TV. I would venture to say that it is most responsible for the poker boom we are seeing right now. Great trip report BTW.

[npknhldr]

Earlier this year Venetian spread a horrible 8/16 game with $4 chips. I'm glad that's been replaced by 9/18 with $3 chips, but crossXfingers that it won't die after WSOP. Were they still doing a low rake deal?