AK live hand

[DavidC]

Just curious what you guys think of this. Villain is a live game small stakes tag. He's not too sophisticated and he's a little on the passive side preflop and post-flop.

I'm something like UTG+1 and I raise A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2 cold-calls, and villain (button) reraises, SB folds, BB calls, I cap, everyone calls. (20.5 sb).

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

bb checks, I check, one of the cc'ers mucks, the other CC'er checks, villain bets, bb folds, I call, middle dude calls. (23.5sb = 11.75 bb)

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I check, middle checks, villain bets, I call, middle calls.

River: 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I check, middle checks, villain bets, I call, middle ... can't remember what he did, I think fold.

[bellatrix]

Huh? I think they are some bets missing there from you? Why no bet on the flop? Why no bet on the turn?

[tyler_cracker]

dave,

i would just lead the flop because i am not very sophisticated.

i guess you're worried that villain's pf 3betting range has you crushed? i feel you there, but playing super passive like this cannot be right in a giant multiway pot.

[knockonwood]

You are behind to KK,QQ,JJ,KQ, KJ and AT on the turn. KQ,KJ and ATo and possibly JJ can be eliminated from the villains range and also MP if you can't remember him raising. I would check raise this turn and call down a 3bet. You are ahead here more than you think IMO.

edit: You couldn't have known that MP would fold after you acted....He could have check-reraised yourself and villain. This does make the hand harder to play as there are quite a few combo's he could have that beat you.

[bellatrix]

[ QUOTE ]
You are behind to KK,QQ,JJ,KQ, KJ and AT on the turn. KQ,KJ and ATo and possibly JJ can be eliminated from the villains range and also MP if you can't remember him raising. I would check raise this turn and call down a 3bet. You are ahead here more than you think IMO.


[/ QUOTE ]

Just a minor nitpick that KK is not possible on the turn, which is why the really only plausible hands you are behind on the turn are QQ and JJ. KQs, KJs and ATs are a bit more implausible...

[Dr. Matt]

w
t
f david

did you have a siiick read?

[bozlax]

At first glance I was like, "wft?" Then I looked again. Dave could fold on the flop, you're ahead of nothing and giving up bets to a lot. On the turn, you pull ahead of AA and QJ, but nothing else, and you have to discount those holdings because nobody's budging. Yeah, Kx is unlikely, but why raise anywhere and let it pwn you? What does raising do for us? Possibly get us HU with a better hand, there's a noble goal.

[bellatrix]

Yeah, probably raising is not good, but is donking such a bad idea? I think it was played so passively...

[Goodnews]

[ QUOTE ]
At first glance I was like, "wft?" Then I looked again. Dave could fold on the flop, you're ahead of nothing and giving up bets to a lot. On the turn, you pull ahead of AA and QJ, but nothing else, and you have to discount those holdings because nobody's budging. Yeah, Kx is unlikely, but why raise anywhere and let it pwn you? What does raising do for us? Possibly get us HU with a better hand, there's a noble goal.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree somewhat. Remember that OP was the one to cap it, thus we will not know if where we are on this flop. It wouldn't be a long shot to say that villain could be holding AQ here (though he is on the passive side, his 3-betting pf range is certainly not limited to AA, KK and AK).

You are right to say that the vast majority of the time, we are behind on this flop, but the pot is so huge at this point, we even have odds to draw to the gutshot to chop. So folding is not an option.

Furthermore, on this flop, all hands villain is willing to raise with pf will bet this flop, including the mentioned AQ. My reasoning is that if villain is an unsophisticated player, then he will read the checks to him as weakness and that he may have dodged the king and bets.

On the turn we do move ahead of AA and QJ, and make AQ drawing dead. But given that the turn was a king, and that villain may have been somewhat worried that he was beat by a K, that thought is even further from his mind at this point. Given that the combinations of Kx hands just got cut by 33%.

On the river, I check and call as well. A hand that beats us will certainly have a monster and will not hesitate to raise, and a hand that is losing may still believe that there is hope that their hand is best.

HOWEVER, it is at this point on the river it is important to know the psychological state that villain is in. Some players get to thinking that 'this pot is big enough' and thus they check behind us with a hddn we expect them to bet.

[tehox]

Intersting hand. It all comes down to the hand ranges of the preflop three bet. In any case I think its a good turn card for you and I don't want to give free cards in a big pot and would bet it.