200: Pwned

[ToomuchCoffee]

Coming from Limit, and still beeing new to NL (40k hands). It looks that 60x fits my play best. But that is because I don´t have to pay an extra 40bb for my limitmistakes and it is easier to play agressive without a monster.
I hope my game improves, but right now I´m sure it would be -EV to buy in full.

[Specialwon]

This is getting a bit off topic, but I wouldn't recommend shortstacking as part of the moving up process, unless you already have a lot of experience at that stack level.

Shortstacking changes the dynamic of the game, and its likely to disorient you even more at a time when you are probably already on edge and worried that all the other players are incredibly wise and have psychic powers and so forth.

I'd say if you want to reduce your exposure at a new level, you're better off dropping your table load.

I too would fold the river, I think you need to have actually seen villain do at least one outrageous bluff already before you can call this.

[ActionStan]

In this case, I would have bought in for the 50BB. Generally, though, for me constantly rebuying is very leaky. This may be just me, but I find rebuying 5 and 15BB really lets me play badly for too long. When I'm playing my B and C game on the table and my A game in my head, I find that I have donked off 2 buy-ins without really ever having felt the sting. Anyone else? Anyone? Buehler? Anyone? Meaningful chunks of 30-50BB is much more likely to make me reconsider how I'm playing (and sometimes it's just plain awful).

[checkmate36]

I just wanted to say congrats to OP for making it to 200NL. It wasn't too long ago that OP awitched from LHE to NL.

Since we are slightly off topic, I want to put in my vote for sitting with 50BB's. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Jeff76]

[ QUOTE ]
This is getting a bit off topic, but I wouldn't recommend shortstacking as part of the moving up process, unless you already have a lot of experience at that stack level.

[/ QUOTE ]Buying in for 40 or 50BBs is not what I think of when I think of shortacking. You can play a very effective game with 50BBs and you will find yourself in less tricky spots than when you buy in full. It's not a bad idea for a player getting is feet wet in a new game.

Also, while I agree that buying in full is good because you can get maximum value against the worst players, truth is most players I see buying in full are not the donks.

[threads13]

[ QUOTE ]

Shortstacking changes the dynamic of the game, and its likely to disorient you even more at a time when you are probably already on edge and worried that all the other players are incredibly wise and have psychic powers and so forth.

[/ QUOTE ]

There was some decent points in this post but this jumpst out to me. Remember, you should constantly be adjusting to stack sizes. Having 50BB is no different than having 100BB where everyone to your left has 50 or less.

Just because "short stacking" (this is more small-medium) has a bad reputation on 2+2 doesn't mean that it is a bad thing. Another example is that a lot of people are against min-raising here, but it has it's uses. If you just shrug off these things because "only donks do that" then you will not be improving your game in areas that it could use improving. Beware of group-think.

[checkmate36]

[ QUOTE ]
Another example is that a lot of people are against min-raising here, but it has it's uses. If you just shrug off these things because "only donks do that" then you will not be improving your game in areas that it could use improving. Beware of group-think.


[/ QUOTE ]

Well said.

[GiantBuddha]

Excellent post, threads. People seem to think that they can choose not to short stack. You can't. You can choose to short stack, at least until you double up, but you can't always choose not to. Even if you're at a table with 7 full stacks and 1 shortie, if you raise to 4BB, shortie shoves, and everyone else folds, now you're playing short stack poker. You must know how to deal with this situation.

I just spent three weeks playing 50K hands of short stack and I definitely learned a lot. I'm planning on making a thread on this when I get home, because I think a lot of players could benefit from this.

If you don't have an edge on the players buying in full, don't buy in full. That said, if you don't think you have an edge on many of the players when you sit down, maybe there's a better game somewhere else?

Oh, and fold TPWK to the overpush.

[Specialwon]

I seem to be getting a bad press here for some reason. I never said shortstacking was bad. Some of my best friends are shortstackers. Though obviously I wouldn't allow my sister to marry one.

[threads13]

[ QUOTE ]
I seem to be getting a bad press here for some reason. I never said shortstacking was bad. Some of my best friends are shortstackers. Though obviously I wouldn't allow my sister to marry one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Na, I know you aren't bashing. I was just pointing out the fuzzy thinking that you had going with your point and then I was going into a launch that was caused from the previous posts by others. Playing a short stack shouldn't disorient you because you should be playing short stack because often the effective stacks will make it so.

Sorry if it came out that I was bashing you. I'm not... this time. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]