online 10/25. 84o free look makes big hand. - Page 4

Maulik · #31 05-01-2006, 12:51 PM

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I would call and open push the river.

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call the turn raise followed by checking riv is a sure fire way to keep money from getting in here.

I like riv push b/c it may look like a bluff but I doubt his stack is coming in after a weak player limps in the CO...

tdarko · #32 05-01-2006, 01:14 PM

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I would call and open push the river.

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mak15 · #33 05-01-2006, 01:40 PM

i like smallish 3bet push river.

MDMA · #34 05-01-2006, 02:24 PM

Not really getting what luckychewy is talking about here, I'm expecting FV to c/c and BET on that 8 on turn with AT approx. 0% of the time so that example was really lousy. If someone would take that pretty damn awful line however, a fold to a raise should be pretty much standard vs anyone except some real maniac obviously. As far as the hand goes I think it goes without saying that I'm leading flop but then again you already knew that yourself so that's irrelevant here.

Since we haven't gotten much info we just basically has to estimate the likelihood of an unknown (who's obviously bad judging by the limp) being on a bluff/semibluff in this spot, and play accordingly. If we decide there's a good chance he is then the play is obviously to call and check river, but my instinct tells me that he's basically having a hand here most of the time, and as such, given your image I'd push right away. I don't really like the idea of calling and open-pushing any river, since I obviously don't want something like a diamond/T to fall and give him a chance to get away from his likely overpair. As fair as people being afraid of him checking a good T/overpair behind on river (on blanks), I find that HIGHLY unlikely if he's the kind of player who would raise with those holdings on this turn in the first place. I'm not getting the merit of calling and openpushing river if we've decided that he's bad and would raise with a good T here, since any overcard would give him a chance to get away. Only reason to call and openpush is obviously that it's looking like a very strange line and therefore "bluffy", and less important to give him a chance to improve a bit, but I don't think those reasons are good enough if we have reason to suspect that he's raising as light as with an overpair/a T here and will call here just as likely as on river (e.g disregarding the "bluffiness" of calling and openpushing river), since any paint/diamond/T/7 might get him to go away. I'd say either push turn or call and c/r river.

FWIW, people even mentioning that they wouldn't find a fold here are just an insult to FV's skill.

luckychewy · #35 05-01-2006, 02:38 PM

I guess I have a lot to learn from this thread? I don't quite understand how you could ever fold this being slightly more than 100BB deep against a villain you have a small sample size on is beside me.

FWIW I would 3-bet turn, but since everything else I've said in this thread has been shot down I'd like to see what reasons there are for folding...

TheWorstPlayer · #36 05-01-2006, 02:44 PM

no one in this entire thread is suggesting folding

Yeti · #37 05-01-2006, 02:44 PM

luckychewy,

Maybe you are just getting confused with who the replies are directed at. I hope.

84 - never fold.
AT - fold every time as played, not that he would ever play it like that.

luckychewy · #38 05-01-2006, 02:53 PM

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luckychewy,

Maybe you are just getting confused with who the replies are directed at. I hope.

84 - never fold.
AT - fold every time as played, not that he would ever play it like that.

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Understood, I thought some one was saying to fold the 84...thank you.

I was simply asking if he would ever play AT that way that's all.

MDMA · #39 05-01-2006, 02:53 PM

Ehrm, I never suggested folding obviously, you misread. What I meant was that I thought it was silly that some people even felt the need to say that they'd never consider a fold here, I mean that goes without saying, and mentioning it is just insulting to FV [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

luckychewy · #40 05-01-2006, 02:57 PM

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Ehrm, I never suggested folding obviously, you misread. What I meant was that I thought it was silly that some people even felt the need to say that they'd never consider a fold here, I mean that goes without saying, and mentioning it is just insulting to FV [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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Alrighty, now that we're all on the same page...did you 3-bet or just call FV?