My Hall of Fame Ballot

[Triumph36]

mondo,

you are arguing two things. one is who you think will get in, and the other is who you think the BBWAA will let in.

somehow i am not surprised that you think these things match up perfectly

[Pudge714]

Mondo,
Assuming steroids are irrelevant (I know they aren't, but just work under that assumption)
McGwire got on base more often and hit for more power than Rice. They played for a similar amount of time. How is Rice better?

Tim Raines' OPS+ was similar to Rice he played for longer and he had much more value running and defensively.

McGwire >>>>>>> Kingman.

[J.R.]

[ QUOTE ]
McGwire was certainly a better batter than Kingman -- I'm not saying the two are *exactly alike*. However, Kingman is the most comparable career stat line to McGwire of those who are out there, and given the controversy, I just don't see him getting in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dissimilar

Kingman = career .236/.302/.478
McGwire = career .263 /.394 /.588

More similar

Kilebrew = career .256/.376/.509
McCovey = career .270/.374/.515
Cash = career .271/.374/.488

[doubLe a tom]

Rice is not better than McGuire, that said, they probably both belong in the hall of fame.

[Mondogarage]

[ QUOTE ]
mondo,

you are arguing two things. one is who you think will get in, and the other is who you think the BBWAA will let in.

somehow i am not surprised that you think these things match up perfectly

[/ QUOTE ]

I hardly think they match up perfectly. I think Gossage and Rice are years overdue, and their exclusion thus far is pretty unforgivable. Clearly, I've been wrong about those guys for several years.

Like I said, it wouldn't really shock me if McGwire eventually gets in, but I don't see where, in the last 10 years or so, the guys who were first eligible and weren't really close to getting in, eventually got in. So I think, in this case, McGwire ends up not getting in.

[doubLe a tom]

goose gossage deserves to be in the HOF simply due to his awesome mustache and cool name

[sylar]

[ QUOTE ]

sylar - don't you remember Lee Smith as a Yankee, or are you that young?

[/ QUOTE ]

in 1993 i was busy throwing empty bottles at communists occupying this building.

[lobster]

im surprised that no one here has picked shawon dunston

[mosdef]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
McGwire was certainly a better batter than Kingman -- I'm not saying the two are *exactly alike*. However, Kingman is the most comparable career stat line to McGwire of those who are out there, and given the controversy, I just don't see him getting in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dissimilar

Kingman = career .236/.302/.478
McGwire = career .263 /.394 /.588

More similar

Kilebrew = career .256/.376/.509
McCovey = career .270/.374/.515
Cash = career .271/.374/.488

[/ QUOTE ]

Most similar players (http://www.baseball-reference.com/m/mcgwima01.shtml)

Jim Thome (826)
Jose Canseco (808)
Carlos Delgado (803)
Harmon Killebrew (783) *
Willie McCovey (767) *
Jason Giambi (756)
Juan Gonzalez (739)
Norm Cash (736)
Dave Kingman (732)
Manny Ramirez (730)

*HOF

Two HOF in top 5, a couple of other probables as well. Also Kingman is in there.

[Pudge714]

Mosdef,
All of those similarity scores are pretty low fwiw.