Flopped bottom two against a 2p2 Tag

[j4lvlie]

calling the 3 bet then calling it down.

[Chipspin]

Thanks for the responses everybody. I think it's interesting the majority of opinions favor calling the 3-bet and reevaluating the turn. Usually when I flop bottom two, I just raise raise raise until I'm sure I'm beat or I get counterfeited.

Maybe this will be a useless hypothetical, as you're all already aware that Bdaddy had a OOP flop 5-betting hand. But just for curiosity, assume you don't know that. And assume I had flat-called the flop 3-bet. Then we advocate raise/folding a safe turn card? And calling down a scary turn card?

And for the record, Bdaddy doesn't spew. He might get a little tricky against me, but 99% of the time he's not putting in that much flop action without a hand (eg just a flush draw or openended or something).

[bdaddy]

I only spew a little. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] BTW, I might go 5 bets in this game w 89hh.

Additionally, about 20 min after this hand its folded to me in HJ(seat7), and I raise KdJx, Chipspin insta 3 bets me(Seat8) and the blinds reluctanly fold. The flop is
8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], and I insta checkraise Chipspin and he quickly mucks his hand. Several of the players at the table instantly spring to life, start yelling at us, "You cant do that crap!" , basically accusing of us colluding.

[Munchkin Mayor]

I think four betting is fine. most of the time 2 pair is best here. it is only because you have been 5 bet that you have the info suggesting you are behind. Even so you don't know for sure til you see the turn.

[vmacosta]

[ QUOTE ]
I only spew a little. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] BTW, I might go 5 bets in this game w 89hh.

Additionally, about 20 min after this hand its folded to me in HJ(seat7), and I raise KdJx, Chipspin insta 3 bets me(Seat8) and the blinds reluctanly fold. The flop is
8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], and I insta checkraise Chipspin and he quickly mucks his hand. Several of the players at the table instantly spring to life, start yelling at us, "You cant do that crap!" , basically accusing of us colluding.

[/ QUOTE ]

russ,
you deserve to get accused of cheating for making such a bad flop fold. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

i once accused tnt and kurt of colluding after tnt played a hand so unbelievably terrible and forced me to have to give up my full-house draw on the turn. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Chipspin]

[ QUOTE ]
I only spew a little. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] BTW, I might go 5 bets in this game w 89hh.

Additionally, about 20 min after this hand its folded to me in HJ(seat7), and I raise KdJx, Chipspin insta 3 bets me(Seat8) and the blinds reluctanly fold. The flop is
8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], and I insta checkraise Chipspin and he quickly mucks his hand. Several of the players at the table instantly spring to life, start yelling at us, "You cant do that crap!" , basically accusing of us colluding.

[/ QUOTE ]

haha

That's right. Nobody else at that table played the raise/reraise/fold style we do. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

And Vmacosta, I folded, cuz I didn't think my full house draw was any good. Usually I don't show a laydown like this (and if I do, I prepare to start calling down A-high for the remainder of the session...), but since it was Bdaddy I showed, and he showed me K6. So I actually had two good outs.... Next time it's 6 bets. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[vmacosta]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I only spew a little. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] BTW, I might go 5 bets in this game w 89hh.

Additionally, about 20 min after this hand its folded to me in HJ(seat7), and I raise KdJx, Chipspin insta 3 bets me(Seat8) and the blinds reluctanly fold. The flop is
8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], and I insta checkraise Chipspin and he quickly mucks his hand. Several of the players at the table instantly spring to life, start yelling at us, "You cant do that crap!" , basically accusing of us colluding.

[/ QUOTE ]

haha

That's right. Nobody else at that table played the raise/reraise/fold style we do. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

And Vmacosta, I folded, cuz I didn't think my full house draw was any good. Usually I don't show a laydown like this (and if I do, I prepare to start calling down A-high for the remainder of the session...), but since it was Bdaddy I showed, and he showed me K6. So I actually had two good outs.... Next time it's 6 bets. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

russ,
i was referring to the 852 all diamond board where you 3-bet pf and then folded to a flop c/r getting 9:1 and hu in position. Almost every hand you could have there is making a 1 sb mistake folding there.

Also, in the 76 hand you folded to the flop 5-bet? Or folded on the turn. Folding on the turn is sorta bad but folding on the flop is horrendous--like almost 1 BB mistake.