TAG vs LAG play

[p4594spa]

I play mostly 8-16 or 10-20. I had a 3 month stretch play SSHE type TAG play where I won everytime at a rate of 1.5 to 2 BB/hour. I am not telling you this to brag, but rather to set the stage for the next question. At the 8-16 table, there are typically (at Bay 101), 1-2 players who play a very loose and reasonably agressive play pre-flop, and are typically the biggest winners at the table which typically is otherwise filled with tight, passive players.

As a result of this observation, I have spent the last two month trying out a looser, agressive style. It has been a miserable failure and I really don't why. I was betting the same range as the LAGs that I have been observing.

Any thoughts you might have, I'd be interested in hearing.

[Aces McGee]

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Any thoughts you might have, I'd be interested in hearing.



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It could be variance, or it could be that they play better postflop than you do.

-McGee

[StrictlyStrategy]

Don't do it. ESPECIALLY with Cali's unbelievable rake structure. You ever seen an 80/6/.5 go on unreal rushes? That's all.

[One Outer]

What percentage of hands are you entering pots with? You might have to open up more. When you play this way you're going to win more pots, but you're also going to lose more pots so you really need to be wide open to make up for not getting there sometimes.

If I were you I would start playing all the no gap connectors. Once you show down the nut straight a few times other players will start respecting your raises and you'll be able to win more pots.

Good luck.

[Scarmiglio]

This could be short term variance, but I would guess your post flop game isn't up to the task of making laggy play profitable. Good lags know how to eek out tiny profits from marginal hands over and over. Bad lags make small mistakes dozens of times per session. These small mistakes add up to big losses. Stick to your TAG game. It may not be quite as profitable, but the variance is lower and it's a proven way to get the monies.

[DeuceKicker]

1. Variance.

2. You see the times they're at the table for six hours dominating the weak/tighties. What you don't see is the many times they lose their buy-in and leave before you ever get there.

3. Good LAGs know how to play post-flop, often better than TAGs because they find themselves in tough situations much more often. TAGs often just wait for good cards and jam the hell out of them.

4. Variance

I'm not sure many LAGs have a starting hand range, with EP, MP, and LP considerations. They play more by feel (sometimes whim) but often seem to intuit some advantageous plays that they couldn't explain mathematically, but are nevertheless sound. If you just try to imitate them ("well I saw him open limp with Q8, so I'll try that too") you're not going to have much success.

[threeducks]

[ QUOTE ]
I play mostly 8-16 or 10-20. I had a 3 month stretch play SSHE type TAG play where I won everytime at a rate of 1.5 to 2 BB/hour. I am not telling you this to brag, but rather to set the stage for the next question. At the 8-16 table, there are typically (at Bay 101), 1-2 players who play a very loose and reasonably agressive play pre-flop, and are typically the biggest winners at the table which typically is otherwise filled with tight, passive players.

As a result of this observation, I have spent the last two month trying out a looser, agressive style. It has been a miserable failure and I really don't why. I was betting the same range as the LAGs that I have been observing.

Any thoughts you might have, I'd be interested in hearing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have played 30 sessions on the Bay 101 8/16 tables (113 6/12) and I understand where you are coming from. I can not believe my eyes when they turn over their cards. But, like said above they play well after the flop and it's variance.

One day I lost $800 on the 8/16 table and walked over to the 20/40 and won $1250. Variance and some luck. Which is great for the short run.

In my opinion you need a good read on the Bay 101 8/16 players to succeed. Some of the 20/40 players play 8/16 waiting for a game. I would recommend that you stick with SSHE type play which I am still trying to master. Playing too lose may be fun but I do not think it is the way to win long term.

I am still learning so take my advice with a grain of salt (if seconded by some of the old hands here, then okay).

[threeducks]

Generally speaking of LAG play. The California Grand in my opinion is one of if not the loosest 10 player 6/12 game in the Bay Area. There are 6-8 to the flop all the time and sometimes with a capped pot. That said, some of them play very well post flop and very loose preflop. Few fold on the flop. The like to peel a card to see the turn and they like to call the river with Aces. There is a 70k+ jackpot so that adds to the loose play. Further, the blind structure is $6,$4,$2. There is no chopping the blinds.

So, my point? Hard game for me to consistently beat. I think that he Bay 101 games are a close second. But, Bay 101 is 9 players. Oaks is loose and has 10 players.