Updated Cliff Notes On Absolute Poker Scandal (18th October)

[dergitarrist]

Whilst I agree that this should not go down in a pathetic witch hunt with wild speculations about other people possibly involved, I also think it'd be naive to assume that only these few accounts and people were cheating over a rather short period of time, beating the high stakes community for said ~$700k.

In my opinion it is also highly likely that others have used #363 before (or there's more accounts with similar features) in a less obvious way, appearing to be just consistently "running good" and beating the community for far more than the afore mentioned sum.

The only way to properly figure this out, though, is on Absolutes side by - for example - reviewing all instances where #363 has been watching a table and someone with the same ip logged in to play at the same table. Over YEARS. Only then can you find all people with access to #363 and figure out how much money EXACTLY has been stolen from the players at AP. This is - from my POV - also the only way for AP to come clean and start over.

What strikes me as odd is how POTRIPPER and the others were so damn outright obvious about them being able to see others hole cards. Culminating in POTRIPPERs "put you all to sleep one by one" table-trash-talk. I've been a poker player for not even a year now, playing mid stakes NLHE and I'm sure I could be less blatant about it. Scott Tom and the others appear to have been around the game for YEARS and MOST CERTAINLY have the necessary knowledge about the game to be less obviously cheating, even were they to be bad players.

Wild speculation won't get us anywhere, though. So let's get back to the facts and hope they're gonna be enough to get AP to do some work on their side to regain the trust of the playing community.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Even if the Kahnakawe Commission were truly independent of Absolute, does their audit really mean anything? Any audit is only as trustworthy as the auditor, so what assurance do we have that this gaming commission performs complete, rigorous audits? "Our software is fully licensed by the Kahnakawe Gaming Commission" means about as much to me as "Our software is fully licensed by Grimstarr". In other words, such a statement doesn't help me sleep any easier at night.

[casaubon]

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b) the other gaming companies (over 100?) using Kahawake's servers - with a question attached: Could this happen at your site?


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This is very misleading. MIT is just a data center. Their customers likely own the majority of the servers there. The fact that MIT exists is a good thing for US poker players.

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I'm going to make this as clear as I can.
Absolute Poker by their own statements- as well as Ultimate bet are owned by Tokwiro Enterprises.
Tokwiro Enterprises is founded/owned/controlled in some way by its founder Grand Chief Joseph Tokwiro Norton.
Norton coincidentally is praised by his community for FOUNDING the MIT campus from which the servers are hosted.

AP- owned by Tokwiro. Tokwiro directly related to the server farm. Which "customers" of theirs are we referring to?

They are auditing their own business It doesn't matter that it's "the commission" instead of actually AP doing it in this instance.

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The bolded part is where you overstate your case.

The auditing firm has close ties with Norton, and the Mohawk Licensing commission.

Saying anything else is making assumptions that aren't yet supported by facts as we know them.

Yes, it looks like an incestuous swamp, and I'm very skeptical of the audit, but saying that they are auditing themselves is unfair and incorrect according to any fair reading of the facts.

The work everyone here has done is amazing. I'm just hoping it remains more credible and less hysterical.

[ammbo]

A few things:

Regarding the bustouts of the cheaters from other tourneys, recall that GRAYCAT was in the tournament that POTRIPPER won and blinded out. He did not play a hand. For whatever reason, it seems these accounts were registered in a number of tournaments without anyone playing the accounts.

Regarding Tokwiro Enterprises, Grand Chief Norton allegedly owns it. He was also the chief of the Kahnawake reservation for 20+ years. According to his CV he was instrumental in establishing the KGC and is CEO of MIT. This is a HUGE conflict of interest for a commission he founded to be regulating a poker site his company owns.

His CV

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Post deleted by Gildwulf

[Injection]

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Any word yet as to whether Hellmuth was involved in any capacity?

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Lol as if Hellmuth needs to cheat, zomg ppl!

[adanthar]

latest update, courtesy of a very well researched reporter from Montreal's La Presse: [quoting the AP speculation thread]

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I predict that it will come to light that the company that owns AP and UB is founded by the same person who founded the server farm on which the servers for AP now reside and the commission auditing Absolute Poker is auditing a company belonging to their former Grand Chief.

Oops? was that too factual?

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yeah that's about the size of it

having said that, I'm also told that KGC is panicking about these exciting implications and employing a real company to do the audit for that exact reason

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[adanthar]

btw just got off the phone with abcnews.com

[jmremote]

we need a new shocking development, this is getting kinda old

[ibluffoldladies]

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btw just got off the phone with abcnews.com

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and?