Is there anything more ridonkulous than the mid-limits in AC?

[vikicht]

<<This past weekend I got my pocket rockets UTG cold called by the player immediately to my left who held an 8-4 because it was suited. It went heads up to the flop where he caught 4. He called me all the way down to the river where he caught another, 4, and raised my river bet.>>

Hmmmm...Here is my hand:
He raised 8-4off, I 3 bet with AA, 4 on the flop, runner runner river flush (his 8 is gooood).
Nine how do you look like? I am mid age Russian, black hair / eyeglasses.
X3_kto

[Dynasty]

[ QUOTE ]

Try 10/20, a guy defended his big blind with a 3-4o heads up to my button steal with a K-8s, and proceeded to call me all the way down to my river bet when he hit a four on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Who plays the hand worse? The calling station or the over-aggressive player who tries to bluff the calling station on every street?

[Michael Davis]

Exactly, the guy with the 43 made a marginally poor preflop call and played his hand great postflop. If this is an example of how fishy the play is, I'd find a better game.

-Michael

[nineinchal]

[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, the guy with the 43 made a marginally poor preflop call and played his hand great postflop. If this is an example of how fishy the play is, I'd find a better game.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

Marginally poor? It was a rather large margin. Personally, I don't defend my big blind with a 3-4, even if its suited, that hand is so dominated. You gotta hit the board at least once, and hope that the button raiser in position doesn't hit at all.

If I'm the blind, I say "let's play the next hand, take my ten bucks."

[Dave Mac]

[ QUOTE ]
Try 10/20, a guy defended his big blind with a 3-4o heads up to my button steal with a K-8s, and proceeded to call me all the way down to my river bet when he hit a four on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]
u don't understand poker, that guy played the hand well and if you can't see that u need to re-eval.
dave

[Dave Mac]

[ QUOTE ]
If I'm the blind, I say "let's play the next hand, take my ten bucks."

[/ QUOTE ]

lol that seems like a good strat to me.
dave

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, the guy with the 43 made a marginally poor preflop call and played his hand great postflop. If this is an example of how fishy the play is, I'd find a better game.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

Marginally poor? It was a rather large margin. Personally, I don't defend my big blind with a 3-4, even if its suited, that hand is so dominated. You gotta hit the board at least once, and hope that the button raiser in position doesn't hit at all.

If I'm the blind, I say "let's play the next hand, take my ten bucks."

[/ QUOTE ]

Al - your foot is deeply in your mouth right now, trying to teach a bunch of shorthanded and HU limit hold'em experts what optimal blind play isn't wise - you will be proven wrong every time [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] And yes, the BB played the hand better than you did.

34o is a marginal call at worst pre-flop vs a button who is stealing greater than 31% of the time. A big blind defense hand generally needs 35% equity vs the stealer's hand range. If your attempting to steal less than 30% of the time then you have bigger problems than understanding blind play therefore we will assume your stealing at least 30% but probably closer to the range of 40% or 50% of the time when its checked to you on the button.

I suggest you read Stoxtraders fantastic book Winning in Tough Hold'em Games for more information. BB should be defending with this hand range vs a 40% stealer:


Pairs

22+

Suited

A2s+
K2s+
Q2s+
J2s+
T2s+
92s+
84s+
73s+
63s+
52s+
42s+

Offsuit

A2o+
K2o+
Q4o+
J7o+
T7o+
96o+
86o+
75o+
65o
54o


A player who steals 40% of the time on the button has a range of 33+, A2s+, K2s+, Q5s+, J7s+, T8s+, A2o+, K5o+, Q8o+, J9o

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Try 10/20, a guy defended his big blind with a 3-4o heads up to my button steal with a K-8s, and proceeded to call me all the way down to my river bet when he hit a four on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Who plays the hand worse? The calling station or the over-aggressive player who tries to bluff the calling station on every street?


[/ QUOTE ]

I'll talk the OG bluffer for $500 Alex.

[jeffnc]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, the guy with the 43 made a marginally poor preflop call and played his hand great postflop. If this is an example of how fishy the play is, I'd find a better game.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

Marginally poor? It was a rather large margin. Personally, I don't defend my big blind with a 3-4, even if its suited, that hand is so dominated. You gotta hit the board at least once, and hope that the button raiser in position doesn't hit at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, his play isn't bad at all, especially against you. There is one thing his hand is almost always not, and that's "dominated". And of course, heads up in a blind steal situation, catching any pair is usually enough to call down. Furthermore, you don't have to actually catch, since he is just as likely to steal this pot from you when you whiff the flop as you were to steal the blinds to begin with, so his cards might not even matter.

This hand (a blind steal) is certainly outside the realm of the vast majority of crap play anyway, since it's rare everyone will fold to the button to begin with.

[nineinchal]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, the guy with the 43 made a marginally poor preflop call and played his hand great postflop. If this is an example of how fishy the play is, I'd find a better game.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

Marginally poor? It was a rather large margin. Personally, I don't defend my big blind with a 3-4, even if its suited, that hand is so dominated. You gotta hit the board at least once, and hope that the button raiser in position doesn't hit at all.

If I'm the blind, I say "let's play the next hand, take my ten bucks."

[/ QUOTE ]

Al - your foot is deeply in your mouth right now, trying to teach a bunch of shorthanded and HU limit hold'em experts what optimal blind play isn't wise - you will be proven wrong every time [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] And yes, the BB played the hand better than you did.

34o is a marginal call at worst pre-flop vs a button who is stealing greater than 31% of the time. A big blind defense hand generally needs 35% equity vs the stealer's hand range. If your attempting to steal less than 30% of the time then you have bigger problems than understanding blind play therefore we will assume your stealing at least 30% but probably closer to the range of 40% or 50% of the time when its checked to you on the button.

I suggest you read Stoxtraders fantastic book Winning in Tough Hold'em Games for more information. BB should be defending with this hand range vs a 40% stealer:


Pairs

22+

Suited

A2s+
K2s+
Q2s+
J2s+
T2s+
92s+
84s+
73s+
63s+
52s+
42s+

Offsuit

A2o+
K2o+
Q4o+
J7o+
T7o+
96o+
86o+
75o+
65o
54o


A player who steals 40% of the time on the button has a range of 33+, A2s+, K2s+, Q5s+, J7s+, T8s+, A2o+, K5o+, Q8o+, J9o

[/ QUOTE ]

I read it, its a great book, thats why I steal raise with my hand. BB defender had a 43o, which is not on the chart, so I guess that hand doesn't have the 30% equity.