México has a president

Enrique · #1 09-05-2006, 02:09 PM

Finally the TRIFE (Federal Elections Tribunal) decided on a president. Their decision was unanimous that there was no fraud.
Felipe Calderón is the president of México starting on December 1, 2006 when Vicente Fox leaves office.

I am a little scared on what AMLO will do now, the September 16 parade (Independence Day) usually marches through the Zócalo and AMLO doesn't seem to want to move from there in his protest of the elections.

bobman0330 · #2 09-05-2006, 03:09 PM

I'm really worried about this, because I don't see how the government can do anything to stop Obrador. Sure, it's become obvious to anyone with all the facts that AMLO is just another power-hungry demagogue, but the people who need to stop backing these shennanigans don't necessarily have access to all the facts.

It's probably better to deal with this now though. If AMLO had been elected, I'm confident we would be seeing REAL vote fraud in 2012.

Enrique · #3 09-05-2006, 03:22 PM

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It's probably better to deal with this now though. If AMLO had been elected, I'm confident we would be seeing REAL vote fraud in 2012.

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I agree.
With the actions AMLO has done in the past two months, I am really happy he didn't win.

Howard Beale · #4 09-06-2006, 04:40 AM

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It's probably better to deal with this now though. If AMLO had been elected, I'm confident we would be seeing REAL vote fraud in 2012.

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I agree.
With the actions AMLO has done in the past two months, I am really happy he didn't win.

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He almost won and I still wonder what the moneyed classes will do to address the issues that caused him to almost win in order to prevent him from winning next time around.

Enrique · #5 09-06-2006, 10:58 AM

Well, the next time around is six years away, many things can happen in six years.
AMLO's actions after the election made him lose a lot of his support, so maybe the "moneyed classes" don't need to do anything as they know that AMLO can sink himself down (as he did on this election, he was up by ten points in January).

The real problems are to try to get Congress to work. The polarization that is growing in Congress is troubling.

bobman0330 · #6 09-06-2006, 02:24 PM

link

Just found this link to an op-ed piece from the Post back in July. It's written by the top legal guy from the Gore 2000 Recount campaign. Summary: "[censored] democracy, start a bunch of riots."

Enrique · #7 09-06-2006, 03:15 PM

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link

Just found this link to an op-ed piece from the Post back in July. It's written by the top legal guy from the Gore 2000 Recount campaign. Summary: "[censored] democracy, start a bunch of riots."

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Good link.
It makes sense.
I guess I should start judging AMLO for what he does now and not what he said he would do (since that might have been part of the strategy to get the recount).

In one of the interviews after it was official that Calderón was the elected president, Obrador acted less crazy, in an interview he said things like "We'll get together and see what we do the parallel government in Sept. 16", he didn't say things like "It was fraud, I'll have my own government". Which were things he was saying before.

Felix_Nietzsche · #8 09-07-2006, 10:23 AM

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He almost won and I still wonder what the moneyed classes will do to address the issues that caused him to almost win in order to prevent him from winning next time around.

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In a 3-way race the guy got roughly a third of the vote. This is hardly a mandate.
Mexico has huge economic problems that will be made worse is they elect a Socialist-Commie-Chavez-Lite. The USA has been a pressure valve that absorbs much of the Mexican unemployed due to the incompetance/corruption of Mexican politicians. The best party to cure Mexico's economic ills is PAN. PAN is the new kid on the block and PRI has done everything they can to sabotage PAN's reforms.

To add to Mexico's problems, there is a ground swell of Americans that are growing angry at illegal Mexicans in the USA. The illegals have been steadily abusing the American hospitality. Crime, hit-and-run accidents, using public health services and not paying the bills, etc... There use to be more sympathy and respect towards illegals who were seen as hard working people looking for a better life. Now, this image has been steadily growing more tarnished and public demand for a Berlin-Styled wall at the Mexican border is gaining more support. The turning point for me happen about a year ago I was a victim of a hit-and-run accident by 4 hispanic men in an old beat up car. The irony is they could not be deported if they had stopped and followed the law.

To add insult to injury, when the illegals skipped work to hold pro-illegal rallies in several American cities, the illegals were carrying MEXICAN flags. Just imagine if illegal American immigrants in Mexico held rallies in Mexico City waving American flags.... I have seen interviews of illegals calling Americans Nazis and racists for not letting them stay illegally in the USA (talk about biting the hand that feeds you [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]). If they love Mexico then I say good for them. Stop disrespecting the USA and go back to the country that you think is so wonderful....

The irony is Mexican immigration laws toward Americans are draconian. That son-of-a-bitch Fox criticizes the relativley generous American system towards Mexicans while Mexican laws have abuse Americans for decades. Several years ago, many Americans had their homes stolen by the Mexican govt. In Mexico you can't own a home as an American but you can 'lease' property for 99 years. So several semi-wealthy America retirees built nice homes in Mexico hoping to live the rest of their days in Mexico. Then the Mexican govt ruled the property belong to someone else and took their homes..... Nice guys those Mexican politicians. I say lets adopt the same immigration laws that Mexicans have towards the USA and build the double wall on the entire 3000 mile border. Then it wouldn't matter who Mexico elects. Then Mexico would be forced to look in the mirror and see then enemy is themselves.....

Enrique · #9 09-07-2006, 01:58 PM

It's funny how you think a wall would stop immigration.

I am really sorry for the hit-and-run you received from 4 hispanics. Are you sure they were illegals? What makes you think that? Americans are as capable of that crime as hispanic. Show me some statistics that prove that illegal immigrants do more crime than oher americans, I don't think the statistics will back you up.

Most immigrants are hard working people.

In the rallies, many had their mexican flags, that's true. But a lot of Americans treasure their Irish, German, British descendance. They still have their flags.
I think a bigger statement is to carry an American flag to show that they are Americans too, but I don't see the big deal in having Mexican flags.

You are right that Mexican laws against immigration are tough. But that is no argument for the US to do the same thing in the US. US is a country founded by immigrants and the US usually prefers to take the higher ground. Just because some countries abuse of human rights doesn't mean the US can abuse human rights.
The problem of Mexico's immigration policy is something that shouldn't come up in these debates. Whether an other country does something wrong shouldn't be an excuse for the USA to do something wrong.

Felix_Nietzsche · #10 09-07-2006, 03:25 PM

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It's funny how you think a wall would stop immigration.

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It would stop 98%+ of illegal immigration from the southern border. Which is a good start.

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Are you sure they were illegals? What makes you think that? Americans are as capable of that crime as hispanic. Show me some statistics that prove that illegal immigrants do more crime than oher americans, I don't think the statistics will back you up.

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I live in Texas. When a car of 4 hispanics in an old beat up car hits you and runs....then the odds are about 98% that they are illegals. I concede there is a 2% chance they were not illegals..... I would suggest you save your defense lawyer arguments for the courtroom. They are not persuasive.

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Show me some statistics that prove that illegal immigrants do more crime than oher americans, I don't think the statistics will back you up.

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I don't think American crime statistics track crimes by illegals. They should. American prisons have significant illegal immigrant populations.

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Just because some countries abuse of human rights doesn't mean the US can abuse human rights.

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It is not a human right for Mexicans to break US immigration laws. Mexican politicians are pretty stupid. Their draconian immigration laws against American don't win them any friends north of the border. if they were smart, there would liberalize their immigration laws towards Americans. First they could use this as a public relations campaign to persuade the USA and second not too many Americans would immigrate to Mexico anyway.

You need to face facts. America's view towards illegals are changing from one of respect to anger. Illegals have been abusing American hospitality. They have abused the American welfare system, welched on doctor bills, and interfered in the American political system. There are bills in congress which are authorizing an additional 500+ miles of border fences. These fences will be built strategically so force illegals to take very dangerous routes, taking boats, or just giving up. Mexico has been quite disrespectful towards Americans and unless they get smart, they will see a 3000 mile berlin wall along their northern border. Personally, I hope they continue their stupidity so that the 3000 mile wall gets built.