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  #11  
Old 06-06-2006, 12:02 PM
mpanzer mpanzer is offline
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Location: Brazil
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Default Re: 7-A Five Card Draw

As I mentioned sometime ago this is the way we are used to play here in Brazil, with 5 or less people. If there are six people the dealer doesn't play the hand. If there are more people we split tables.

Flushes are higher than than full-houses but - even though they are slightly less frequent - are lower than quads. Actually, by the time I started playing online, I lost a lot of play money with my flushes...

We play with a different betting structure also - something like the the dealer is SB, next is BB, but the next can make it 2xBB before looking at his cards, and so on. The "Blind's owner" is always last to act - and nobody can raise pre-draw, just call or fold. And usually no one can draw more than 3 cards. But these are home games with different rules, anyway.
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  #12  
Old 06-08-2006, 08:26 AM
bigpooch bigpooch is offline
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Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 1,330
Default Re: 7-A Five Card Draw

Here I describe 7-A with sixes included (when there are
five players dealt in):

The most difficult hands to play are two pairs especially
before the draw. After the draw, the only two pair hands
that you would even consider betting with is aces up and
then only if you are heads up (or if a blind drew four or
five and one other opponent is in the pot) unless there is
a calling station in the pot.


Of course, one of the strongest approaches is the raise/fold
approach (if you open, you raise, except in an unusual
circumstance, such as holding quads) except possibly when
you are heads up with the big blind from the small blind.

Opening with Two pairs
----------------------

Technically, before the draw, you can open raise with all
two pairs from the button and small blind, but if you are
reraised, you usually should fold your worst two pairs as
although you have outs and some implied odds, it's not as
good as you may believe. You need to protect two pairs from
these spots as you don't want a blind drawing cheap and
beating your vulnerable holding.

From the cutoff, you may elect to fold the very worst two
pairs (less than nines up) especially if you don't hold an
ace as sometimes you'll face an opponent that has you beat
or someone with AA (that's why it's nice to hold an ace) who
can easily outdraw you (the chances of improving a pair is
bigger than 40% and even moreso because of the bunching
effect).

Under-the-gun, you simply have to fold any two pairs less
than queens up and even a hand such as AJJTT is perilous
to play (technically, you don't have quite a 4/7 chance of
having the best hand before the draw, but you don't really
require that in theory; on the other hand, some of your
opponents have no problem defending the small blind or cold
calling with hands that are slightly better than JJTT! ).
Also, you are in an unusual spot if you open raised with a
hand such as AA667 from utg and are cold called by the sb
who now draws exactly two cards and are heads up - do you
draw three now? Against an opponent that you KNOW has
trips, you strongly consider drawing three.

AA
--

This is the semibluffing hand that you will use selectively
when utg and sufficient to open raise with. For example, if
you are utg, you would likely raise with AAKQ6, but almost
never do so with AAT76.


Semibluffing
------------

If you had semibluffed occasionally in regular draw, you
can almost forget about it in 7-A with ordinary flush and
straight draws (the only exception may be KQJTx)! You may
consider semibluffing in the best spots (button or small
blind) and in the earlier positions, you prefer to do so
with a good straight flush draw.

Nuts and bolts
--------------

You make most of your money in this game predraw by raising
with your good hands so you may as well take notes on your
opponents to see which of them cold call with weak holdings
or defend the blinds with inadequate hands. It is also
useful to notice those players that bluff just so you won't
autofold with borderline "game theory" calling hands!

When you have a very good hand after the draw, you still
have to be careful. A player that has drawn two and raised
you could very well have quads and technically, you really
can't reraise such a player without better than the minimum
quads yourself unless you are against a weak opponent. The
key when you have a big hand against a slightly weaker hand
is how to extract the maximum.


Flush draws
-----------

The big difference is that most of the time, ordinary flush
draws are unplayable. Only 5 out of 31 unseen cards will
complete your hand. What makes matters worse is that even
if you do make your flush, there is even more jeopardy that
your hand after the draw isn't even the best, unlike regular
draw!

Defending the big blind
-----------------------

If you know the raiser has at least two pairs bigger than
the two pairs you have, you simply fold when heads up. You
need some chance of having the best hand before the draw
when you have two pairs; otherwise, you're making a -EV
call. If you know your opponent could be raising with AA,
of course you DON'T want an ace as then it would be less
likely he is open raising with just AA.

Now, it is easier to defend with openenders as your odds of
making your hand is better than in regular draw; still, you
may not want to defend with 6789Q as sometimes two (or more)
aces are tied up in the raiser's hand. Also, you may want
to defend with AA except possibly versus a tight raiser.
Even KKA in the big blind against a cutoff raise is at best
a borderline call.

In this game, it is even more important to follow the logic
of the play; still, this game will appear to be much more
boring than regular draw, as you won't be able to execute as
many expert plays. Nevertheless, you don't find many of
your opponents playing in a disciplined manner.


Drawing one to trips
--------------------

In this game, you draw one to trips much less often when
compared to regular draw for two reasons: a) you want to
increase your chances of making quads as the only site that
you will be playing at allows unlimited raising when it gets
heads up; b) you want to maximize your chances of improving
your hand. Still, you would want to draw one against an
opponent that is likely to pay you off with two pairs:
e.g, if you raised from the cutoff with KKKAx and the small
blind drew one and you are heads up, you would routinely
draw one. On the other hand, in many spots, it's clear that
you must have trips, so may as well draw two to your hand.
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  #13  
Old 06-08-2006, 05:01 PM
Tom Bayes Tom Bayes is offline
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Posts: 891
Default Re: 7-A Five Card Draw

[ QUOTE ]

Flush draws
-----------

The big difference is that most of the time, ordinary flush
draws are unplayable. Only 5 out of 31 unseen cards will
complete your hand. What makes matters worse is that even
if you do make your flush, there is even more jeopardy that
your hand after the draw isn't even the best, unlike regular
draw!


[/ QUOTE ]

I went to the CelebPoker website to read up on the rules for 7-A Draw and they only said <font color="red"> The winner of the hand is the player who holds the highest hand according to universal poker hand rankings. </font>

Apparently flushes do not beat full houses or quads although they should when you work out the combinatorics of the stripped deck game. This makes flushes very unattractive to draw at in this game. If flushes were properly ranked, you could at least feel confident you had the best hand if you hit your 4-outer/5-outer (depending on whether you are playing with the sixes in or out of the deck).

Nice post. I'm tempted to download a Boss Network skin just to try out this game.
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  #14  
Old 06-08-2006, 10:05 PM
bigpooch bigpooch is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 1,330
Default Re: 7-A Five Card Draw

Just an addition to the figures you provided for 7-A when
played in practice: namely, when the game is 5-handed, sixes
are also included in the deck so that there are now 36 cards
instead of just 32.


There are now C(36,5) = 376992 hand combinations, and from
the strongest hands, the combinations (and probabilities)
for them are:

24 straight flushes (0.0000637)

288 quads (0.0007639)

1728 full houses (0.004584)

480 ordinary flushes (0.001273)
[Ordinary flushes DO NOT beat a full house at the only
online site that spreads the game.]

6120 straights (0.01623)

16128 trips (0.04278)

36288 two pairs (0.09626)

21504 combinations of AA (similarly, for KK etc.)
so there are

193536 combinations of one pair (0.5134)

122400 nothing (0.3247)
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  #15  
Old 06-09-2006, 12:24 PM
mpanzer mpanzer is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brazil
Posts: 48
Default Re: 7-A Five Card Draw

Another thing that should be noted - with the 32 cards stripped deck - is that when you have no pair you almost always have a straight draw. If it is not a gut draw your odds are 8/27 instead of 8/47. Even the 4/27 gut draw is almost as good as the usual 8/47 full-deck straight draw.
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