Loose call in the BB

[jason1990]

Villain is 20/12/2.1 over 300 hands. Seems like a solid, but not terribly tricky player. I feel my pre-flop call is dubious at best, but I'm more interested in feedback on the post-flop play.

Absolute Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $1/$2
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is BB with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
<font color="#cc0000">UTG raises</font>, 4 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4.5SB, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#cc0000">UTG raises</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4.25BB, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#cc0000">UTG raises</font>, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: 1BB returned to UTG.

Results:
Final pot: 6.25BB

[sharpie]

I would check/raise the flop and take it from there.

[W. Deranged]

There are like a zillion ways to play this hand.

1. Your line. (Good against medium aggro. players who have relatively wise hand-ranges but play somewhat straightforwardly).

2. Check-call flop, donk-turn. (Best if your opponent is transparent but passive, and will check behind the turn whenever he has overcards but never raise a worse hand).

3. Check-raise flop. (Good against LAGs, I think. This line guarentees a certain amount of money must go in the pot. If I'm check-raising, I usually like to do so with the intent of getting to showdown unless raised on a big-bet street. So i'm calling down if three-bet.)

It's a fun sort of situation, which I don't think I have a great grasp on. This is the sort of thing that high limit players must do extremely well, and where really great short-handed players thrive.

And the pre-flop defense is fine, though it's important to think about how comfortable you are against your opponent when deciding to defend in such borderline situations.

[elffaw]

worthless preflop comment: I'd insta defend this against a CO or Button raise, but I'm thinking it must be pretty marginal against a utg raise from a 12 pfr

[Scary_Tiger]

FWIW I would fold preflop and c/r this flop and call down a 3-bet. If he waited till the turn to raise me I'd muck it.

[jason1990]

Two people said they would check-raise the flop, with one person saying they would call down if 3-bet. W. Deranged wrote that this is a good line against LAGs. But my read on Villain is that he's not a LAG. Based on this small sample of replies, it seems like check-raising the flop may be a "default" play in this situation for some people. But my default play would be to bet out. To me, check-raising here seems a bit "over the top". I would like to hear more about people's thoughts on check-raising vs. betting out.

[ILOVEPOKER929]

[ QUOTE ]
Two people said they would check-raise the flop, with one person saying they would call down if 3-bet. W. Deranged wrote that this is a good line against LAGs. But my read on Villain is that he's not a LAG. Based on this small sample of replies, it seems like check-raising the flop may be a "default" play in this situation for some people. But my default play would be to bet out. To me, check-raising here seems a bit "over the top". I would like to hear more about people's thoughts on check-raising vs. betting out.

[/ QUOTE ]

I promise you this much, check/raising here is much better than betting out.

[Mossberg]

[ QUOTE ]
Two people said they would check-raise the flop, with one person saying they would call down if 3-bet. W. Deranged wrote that this is a good line against LAGs. But my read on Villain is that he's not a LAG. Based on this small sample of replies, it seems like check-raising the flop may be a "default" play in this situation for some people. But my default play would be to bet out. To me, check-raising here seems a bit "over the top". I would like to hear more about people's thoughts on check-raising vs. betting out.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can trust the opinions of those who advise a flop c/r, they know their stuff [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

The main reason I dislike a donk, is that it is almost 2nd nature for most aggressive players to raise when you donk here.. He'll gladly raise you with his two strong overs (say AK or AQ), and this gives him the oppurtunity to get a cheaper showdown/free card if he wants. Take the initiative with a C/R, kill his oppurtunity for a free-card/cheap showdown.. Also, as I mentioned before, when he raises your flop donk, it could mean almost anything, however, if he 3bets your C/R or pops you on the turn after your C/R, you can be much more confident that you're finished.

[Bob Sacamano]

With AP rake, the preflop call is almost assuredly a losing one.

[agent_fish]

*grunch*

I would fold this pf since he is raising UTG. If it were a LP raise I would call.

I would c/r the flop. If 3-bet I would call and probably check-fold the turn UI since the only thing we're beating is an OC FD.