floating the semi-bluff check/raise

[bbbushu]

UB $1/$2 6 max 5/6

CO is like a weak-tight TAG; s/he seems to think about the hand, etc. but has backed down easily without a very strong hand so far. this isn't much of a read, i know, but i'm really more looking for thoughts on this kind of move, in the first place. i'll admit i'm posting this hand because i've started doing this a little bit lately (almost unintentionally) and i'm not sure about its merit or if i'm just turning into a LAG.

Chun li is BB K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Pre-flop:
one fold, CO calls, two folds, <font color="green">Chun li checks</font>

(2.5 small bets)

Flop:
2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

<font color="green">Chun li checks</font>, CO bets, <font color="green">Chun li calls</font>

(2.25 small bets)

Turn:
5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

<font color="green">Chun li checks</font>, CO bets, <font color="green">Chun li raises</font>

thanks,
bbbushu

[DCWildcat]

If the flop were lower, or this = high stakes, I'd like it a lot more. Why not raise PF?

[DCWildcat]

I should add, I don't actually mind it that much anyway.

What is pissing me off is that my [censored] avatar keeps disappearing every day

[bbbushu]

dcwildcat,

raising pre-flop didn't really occur to me. it was already heads-up and my hand seems kinda weak (in that i predict with the majority of boards i'd rather check/fold than bet/call and check/fold the turn). i'd rather keep my relative position, i guess? i dunno.

the flop being all broadway and [censored] is definitely a reason to dislike my move, here.

bbbushu

[Tryptamean]

I like KT vs CO open limp = raise pf
can you really call someone tag (even weak-tight) if they open limp CO?

[DCWildcat]

You'd be surprised how bad some tags are.

I raise here 'cause I like momentum.

[Leader]

[ QUOTE ]
dcwildcat,

raising pre-flop didn't really occur to me. it was already heads-up and my hand seems kinda weak (in that i predict with the majority of boards i'd rather check/fold than bet/call and check/fold the turn). i'd rather keep my relative position, i guess? i dunno.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd rather have the initiative and a bigger pot if the player is weak.

[ QUOTE ]
the flop being all broadway and [censored] is definitely a reason to dislike my move, here.

[/ QUOTE ]

You should just bet the flop. It's not an ideal flop to bet, but you probably have like 12 outs and CO doesn't have much it seems. The play you made seems like it just risks more then you need to get the job done.

[bbbushu]

leader,

i agree with you. assume the same CO raises pre-flop and i defend. do you check/raise the flop, check/raise the turn or check/call both and hope the river is a T, A or club (or maybe K) where i would probably donk all but the T.

more to the point - i know this is FPS but it feels like a powerful move. is there a place for it?

bbbushu

[Leader]

I think it all depends on how passive he is pf. I'm not two interested in investing a lot of bets if his range is pretty strong here. If he's attsb 35-40% and then folding to your raise when he misses, then ahead and c/r the flop.

[bbbushu]

i recognize that check/raising the flop is the more common line. what i'm interested in is waiting for the turn (when most smaller stakes players mistakenly begin thinking about 'saving bets' and thus where i think we generate more fold equity).

i'm assuming it would make more sense to wait for the turn if:

(a) i had more showdown value - like ace-high and my kicker was part of an OESD or flush draw or something. this way i can miss and check and still be good sometimes

(b) villain maintains continuation-momentum on the turn after s/he misses again but shows more respect to heat when the bet doubles, as well; that is to say that after trying to steal, the flop is basically meaningless to this player but his/her hypothetical call (of my check/raise) will be determined by whether they have connected with the board as of the turn

(c) villain is loose enough pre-flop that s/he routinely has a very wide/weak range

(d) villain must be trying to read my hands; they need to be capable of receiving my message


i swear most of the hands i play are standard.

bbbushu