KJo gross spot

KitCloudkicker · #1 10-21-2007, 03:03 PM

live full 10.

EP raises (tight passive). 3 callers, SB calls (2+2), I call in BB with KJo.

Flop is Js5s5c. SB checks, I check, EP bes, 2 calls, SB calls, I CR (eww??) EP calls, everyone calls, SB now 3 bets (??), I call, all call.

Turn 5h. SB bets, I...??

mackthefork · #2 10-21-2007, 03:09 PM

LOL

Raise again pray for some folds, and call down hopefully cheap, no chance you can fold here with the pot this big, I hope you were good.

Regards Mack

StrictlyStrategy · #3 10-21-2007, 03:40 PM

Wow.

Like. We can only barely call the flop here to peel a Jack and laugh in his face when it comes.

Turn fold?

mackthefork · #4 10-21-2007, 04:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Wow.

Like. We can only barely call the flop here to peel a Jack and laugh in his face when it comes.

Turn fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

16 bb in the pot i think i'm going to see SD with this hand, GL though.

Mack

One Outer · #5 10-21-2007, 04:21 PM

grunch

I don't like the checkraise. I think there are so many players behind the pf raiser that I'd lead this.

Turn sucks. I think I'm folding; I can't think of anything the 2+2 is call/3betting in that spot that I'm beating (except maybe A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]- A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. And I don't think he'd lead the turn with that.

non-grunch edit: In this instance I don't think the pot size matters much; we're super screwed with very few, if any, outs.

mackthefork · #6 10-21-2007, 05:30 PM

oh well I'm gonna see SD everytime here, and if its a leak I dont think it's much of one, I've seen too much to ever fold here.

Mack

One Outer · #7 10-21-2007, 09:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
oh well I'm gonna see SD everytime here, and if its a leak I dont think it's much of one, I've seen too much to ever fold here.

Mack

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't argue with that. You're right that if it's a leak it's microscopic.

Grease · #8 10-21-2007, 10:02 PM

I really, really hate the flop C/R. Just call and close the action and see what happens on the turn. Are you happy when he 3-bets? What about when he calls and then raises the turn?

What should have happened: SB donks the turn, you raise, folds back to him, and he either calls down or 3-bets. Either way, you see the SD. Now you're forced to 3-bet because just calling here and letting an A or Q peel is terrible, and again, if he 3-bets, I would have a hard time folding, but if the SB is good, I really don't know what he would have here. A5s? It's hard to put him on anything but a 5 here, unless he was pumping the flop with a FD, but if he's good, he knows that turn is by far the worse turn ever for his hand.

Raise/fold? TBH, I would probably freeze up and call if it were me, but if I had to bet on the proper play, it would be to raise/fold unless he's super amazing and outlevelling you like mad.

mongidig · #9 10-22-2007, 01:32 AM

Sb has played his hand like he has a 5. No way he has a flush draw unless he is an idiot. With an overpair he probably reraises preflop. EP could easily have an overpair and simply be calling down because as you describe he is passive.

I see no reason to raise the turn here. If EP has an overpair he is probably not folding. If EP has just overcards he may fold to a bet anyway.

I suspect you are beat. I could fold if I had a good enough read, but if not I would just call down and hope for the best.

Amaryllis · #10 10-22-2007, 01:48 AM

Why are you building a pot on the flop, tying everyone to the pot, instead of thinking of a way to protect your hand.

Based you your previous play (you should have pretty precise reads since this is live), bet the flop if you think EP would raise with overcards. If he wouldn't, then just check call and re-evaluate.

The way your hand developed, I'd see a SD but wouldn't be too hopeful.