40/80 QQ hand

geormiet · #1 11-26-2007, 06:58 PM

i don't see any merit to checking behind unless you're balancing it with checking behind other types of hands OR if these blinds are a special brand of retarded and you know they will bluff stupidly if you check behind. I personally think that even the worst players will know something is up when you check behind that flop and refrain from putting in money badly on the turn or river.

Definitely call the turn, call the river. never fold in this spot. He could seriously have anything, i think you'll see a hand like A9 or trips more often than Kx.

private joker · #2 11-26-2007, 07:01 PM

I can't remember specifically but the turn might have put a second club on the board -- if this were the case, would there be any merit in raising the turn and taking a free showdown as opposed to calling the turn and river?

DeathDonkey · #3 11-26-2007, 07:16 PM

Yes I think there would be merit in that.

-DeathDonkey

stinkypete · #4 11-26-2007, 07:37 PM

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Yes I think there would be merit in that.

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random turn donkers also tend to donk rivers. i prefer calling down.

PokerBob · #5 11-26-2007, 08:20 PM

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Yes I think there would be merit in that.

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random turn donkers also tend to donk rivers. i prefer calling down.

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yeah. there is nothing more annoying than doing a FSD raise on the turn, and having the guy barrel the river.

geormiet · #6 11-26-2007, 07:48 PM

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Yes I think there would be merit in that.

-DeathDonkey

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don't think i've ever disagreed w/ a DD strategy post but I don't like a free sd raise here. You're stopping him from bluffing the river and risking a bluff 3bet with say nut flush draw A9

surfdoc · #7 11-26-2007, 08:18 PM

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Yes I think there would be merit in that.

-DeathDonkey

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don't think i've ever disagreed w/ a DD strategy post but I don't like a free sd raise here. You're stopping him from bluffing the river and risking a bluff 3bet with say nut flush draw A9

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Pretty sure DD was referring to checking the flop.

private joker · #8 11-26-2007, 08:25 PM

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Pretty sure DD was referring to checking the flop.

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I don't think so.

DeathDonkey · #9 11-26-2007, 08:26 PM

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Yes I think there would be merit in that.

-DeathDonkey

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don't think i've ever disagreed w/ a DD strategy post but I don't like a free sd raise here. You're stopping him from bluffing the river and risking a bluff 3bet with say nut flush draw A9

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Pretty sure DD was referring to checking the flop.

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No I meant the turn. I am generally against most FSDRs for good reasons, but this seems like one of the best places. Live players don't follow through on the river as often as online donk bluffers do, so there is a decent chance he just check/folds his flush draw on the river (because what the heck did we call him with on the turn). On the other hand, we do risk the bluff 3 bet but I again think this is a very rare play to see in a 40 live game. Another downside is we don't fold out any better hands, which sometimes helps a decision for a FSDR if there is a chance to successfully bluff some part of their range. I definitely don't think its crystal clear one way or the other, just that there is merit in considering FSDRing here, as many of the variables seem ideal.

Also given PJ's probable image I think this play improves in value because his turn raise is really strong and I don't think he'll get screwed with by a bluff 3 bet as often as some (me) would.

-DeathDonkey

Sailboats · #10 11-26-2007, 10:13 PM

Bet the flop.

SB sounds like the type to bet out if he hits a 9 and would c/r a better hand. I think you have to at least call and raise also sounds good given the description of the villian. If he's especially tricky then just follow the safe route and call.