peeling 2 streets with a bad pair

[jfish]

i think hes a bit of a donk. ive been raising his button a bit and he hasnt played back yet and keeps calling pf and c/fing. early in a session though. i just felt like i was "due" to get played back at.

was gonna fold river ui, bad?


Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $5/$10 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $1,148.00
BB: $1,000.00
UTG: $757.00
MP: $1,458.75
CO: $1,475.00
Hero (BTN): $1,583.00

Preflop: Hero is dealt 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 Players)
3 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $30.00</font>, SB calls $25.00, BB folds

Flop: ($70) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
SB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $50.00</font>, <font color="red">SB raises to $150.00</font>, Hero calls $100.00

Turn: ($370) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $290.00</font>, Hero calls $290.00

[Barrin6]

The problem with "I felt like I was 'due' to get played back at" is that you really don't know if he really has a hand or he finally got one after c/f the other flops. So I really don't like it.

[haggy]

If you call the c/r on the flop I like the turn call because I makes so little sense for a random donk to double barrel when the K hits (is he really calling your raise with K6/K7? or 67 oop?). If you think this guy is a donk and that he keeps c/fing I don't think he is the type of individual with value bet A7 relatively thin.

I like a river fold (gross if you spike a 5 or 6 tho). In my experience random donks don't mind the c/r when it looks like you may be cbetting with air and then turn bet again when the "scare" overcard hits, but they won't follow through with the third barrel.

[Barrin6]

[ QUOTE ]
If you call the c/r on the flop I like the turn call because I makes so little sense for a random donk to double barrel when the K hits (is he really calling your raise with K6/K7? or 67 oop?). If you think this guy is a donk and that he keeps c/fing I don't think he is the type of individual with value bet A7 relatively thin.

I like a river fold (gross if you spike a 5 or 6 tho). In my experience random donks don't mind the c/r when it looks like you may be cbetting with air and then turn bet again when the "scare" overcard hits, but they won't follow through with the third barrel.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are ignoring the fact he could have flop sets or 2 pairs here and thus is not scared of the king turn.

[jfish]

yea but thats a pretty small range (esp considering i have a pair) which was why i peeled on the turn K.

[haggy]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If you call the c/r on the flop I like the turn call because I makes so little sense for a random donk to double barrel when the K hits (is he really calling your raise with K6/K7? or 67 oop?). If you think this guy is a donk and that he keeps c/fing I don't think he is the type of individual with value bet A7 relatively thin.

I like a river fold (gross if you spike a 5 or 6 tho). In my experience random donks don't mind the c/r when it looks like you may be cbetting with air and then turn bet again when the "scare" overcard hits, but they won't follow through with the third barrel.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are ignoring the fact he could have flop sets or 2 pairs here and thus is not scared of the king turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, definitely. I am presuming that jfish would have made an extra note if the villain was enough of a donk to call from the sb with 62 or 72, so we can knock those two pairs out, and even then I do not know many people rushing to play 67 oop against an aggressive player. 22,66,77 are definite possibilities. Just in my experience a donk playing very passively is not the type to vb a7/88/99 (I presume he reraises 1010+ at least from a button raise?) thin - I think his range is made up much more of random crap deciding to bluff than set/67.

Honestly, I am still undecided whether I like the flop call or not... but if you call the flop this is a good turn to call as well and be happy about checking behind on the river if he checks to you.

[Jinx]

if I do this I'd raise the turn, or make a move on the river. The K is a perfect card to get him off 87 or whatever crap he has.

[jfish]

i dont think he would bet a 7 here if hes bad, is that an unfair assumption?

[ajloeffl]

Have you seen the type of hands he likes to call your PF raises with (ie a couple showdowns)? Or you can guess based on how often he does call. If it's like 40% of the time then it could be basically anytime he doesn't have a pure garbage hand. If so, his range could have 89, 76, A7s, K7s, 88, 99, set, total bluff with KT on flop gone luckbox, etc. Calling so much of your stack on the turn should only be done if he is going to play pretty straightforward on the river. If you are still left guessing as to whether or not he has a hand when he puts a big bet out on the river...

[GoldenIP]

Agree with most of what was said although I don't think a re-pop on the flop is terrible by any means and I'd definitely throw it in there as an alternative line to take on occasion. The eff. stacks are probably just about big enough I guess. This would work well if you weren't regularly stealing his blind but if you think he was getting agitated and ready to donk off light, be done with the hand and find a better spot.

I think it comes down to whether you're happy to create a big pot on a read that he might be weak and just feeling like he needed to stand his ground for a change. As played, I don't love calling the flop. Well, as long as you've got a plan for the remaining streets, call. It's one of those hands where, if you're happy raising PF with it, but not willing to play a big pot with what is likely to be a marginal holding, which it is, why play it PF. To steal the blinds? Meh...

As above, I'd prefer a re-pop or a fold. I've experimented with the re-pop with hands/situations like this and you'll be surprised at the respect you get even when someone is getting frustrated.