Questions about PPs (PF raise, variance, micros)

[TheBad]

I hope this is the right place for this !

I try to play my PPs as aggressive as possible:
-I raise PF to 3 or 5BBs depending on position.
-I try to take the pot by cbetting.
-I double barrel whenever i have an overpair or my pair + OESD
-When i hit my set i don´t slowplay.

Whenever i play a PP TT or smaller, i think that i need to get 1:10 to justify my call. So whenever i am sure that at least 2 people will call, i raise more PF so i have to make less after the flop in case i hit and they miss. I am willed to put 25% of my stack in if 5 or more people call.

On a tight table OOP i will limp/call, and in position i will raise the same as i would with AA, trying to take the pot with a cbet and building the pot in case we both hit.

Does this sound right to you so far ?


Analysing my last 10k hands,i found a couple of KK vs. AA and Set vs. flushs, so here a couple of observations and questions regarding small PPs:

1) Observation: 50 times 44 and not a single set.
Question: Standard ? How many PPs do we need as sample size to analyze our play ? Is there a way to find out how many times we made a set / Show only hands where we made a set in Pokertracker ? Maybe in Holdemmanager ?
2) Observation: When the flop comes with 3 spades and i have bottom set and we get it all in, i always loose to a flush. Theese hands are very high variance for me.
Question: Do i stack off to easy ? Or is my sample size still to low ? Will i see many TP+Flushdraw once my sample size is big enough ?
3) Observation: My sets are not getting paid enough to justify a pf call if i play fit or fold.
Question: How the [censored] can i find out my average winning whenever i make a set with Pokertracker ? How many BBs do you make on average with a set ?
4) Observation: Losses set vs set & set vs flush are much bigger than winnings sets vs. draws & set vs. TP hands.
Question: Is it better to fold sets on scary boards (AhKh9h and i have 9c9d) to reduce variance or do i really give up too much equity here ?

How do you change your play with PPs when moving up from NL25 -> NL50 -> NL100 ?

[zyrrth]

so this is basically about not hitting sets and getting coolered when you hit...

some thoughts:

on a tight table you usually want to raise pretty much all pp's from any position cause you're gonna take down the blinds a lot, if you get called 3bet villain probably has a hand and it's more likely you'll actually stack him if you hit.

do not limp/call with small pp's in early position, it just gives you hand away unless you also limp with big hands, which is not a good idea, imo.

[Albert Moulton]

I assume that you are talking about a 9- or 10-handed, 100bb max buy-in games where the average stacks are 75bb-175bb, right?

I think you would have to answer each of these questions a little differently depending on whether you were talking about a 20bb game (like some of the live games in Florida right now), a 40-50 bb game (like many 1/1 to 2/2 live games), 100bb game (as exists at most online ring games and many 1/2 to 10/10 live games), or 200+ bb games (like at some "deep" online games and many mid-to-high limit live games).

There is a good secion in NLHETAP about playing "88" as an example hand with different effective stacks and game conditions in which sometimes "raise/call" is better than limp, and sometimes that "limp/call" is better than "raise/fold" for example.

Finally, I would bet that there is some number of short stackers at the table (say, 3 or more) that would cause you to have to alter this kind of play with low pairs, too. So, are you assuming no short-stackers?

[TheBad]

75-125BBs, NL25/NL50 or 1/2 live (max 200 Buyin), 8+ Players.
Trying not to play against shorties.

[jlp_2908]

Yah I play them pretty much like you and I am a winner with every PP.
Im starting to lower the amount of times I cbet with them OOP tho was sorta a leak of mine...I still do, just not as much
Its frustrating folding to shorties all the time tho

[TheBad]

Sometimes i call against shorties.. Lets´s say he has < 25BBs. I raise to 5, he calls, flop comes J high and he instapushes -> I might call sometimes if i think he pushes any flop to maximize fold equity.

[Albert Moulton]

[ QUOTE ]
75-125BBs, NL25/NL50 or 1/2 live (max 200 Buyin), 8+ Players.
Trying not to play against shorties.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you are in an aggressive live game with 75-125BB stacks and with lots of raising and reraising, then making full-sized "standard" raises with hands like 66-99 in EP and MP is probably worse than limp/calling because raise sizes tend to be bigger in live games, and if you get reraised then you end up in a push or fold situation with a mid-pair.

Also, if you raise in EP with mid and low pairs in a live game, you should probably avoid cb'ing in pots with 3 or more players. I've seen plenty of hands like the one where an old guy call down his whole stack with A9o in a 2/3 NL game where the board was something like 2293J and he was up against a guy with AQ who had raised pf from EP, fired at the flop, fired at the turn, and then pushed the river (and lost). So, in many cases, if you miss your set in a live game where you had raised with a mid-to-small pocket pair, it's multi-way, and you're OOP, then c/f is probably better than auto-cb.

Sometimes, small raises in EP with speculative hands as a pot-builder is sometimes good if the game is generally NOT super aggressive and sees a lot of "family" pots. A small open raise can sometimes make a big enough pot that if you flop a set or a straight that you can get somebody on a big draw or with TP all-in by the turn by just betting your hand aggressively. In this game a limp ends up in a pot that is too small OOP to stack somebody when you hit. And if you raise a full amount, then you either get too few callers (rare) or too many callers (more likely) in which case you are essentially paying to much to flop your own set. Also, a small raise can often withstand a reraise without having to fold.

Finally, in deep 200+ games (like at our local 5/5 game), I've just started folding 22-55 in EP and MP. They don't get paid off enough when they hit and nobody else has a big hand. And when somebody else has a big hand, is generally a bigger hand than bottom set. Ciaffone and Reuben wrote about this in one of their PL&NLHE book. I didn't think they were making any sense until I started playing occasionally at the 5/5 $1000 buy-in game. Then that section made more sense to me.

[Bluegrassplayer]

I limp with these live all the time, people play the board more than they play your hand, and they are willing to stack off with much less. Online it's much trickier.