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#21
11-23-2007, 09:18 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'd check behind here w/ AA,KK vs this villian as long as I had a diamond. I love letting these overaggro monkeys hang themselves. [/ QUOTE ] If someone is calling 3bets insanely light and check/raising every flop why would you do this? edit: I'm seriously confused by this entire thread [/ QUOTE ] sry, I don't buy he c/raises light. I'm just taking into account he's aggressive in 3bet pots. Just because someone is capable of bluff pushing 3bet pots doesn't mean they're doing it in high frequency. If you can find a flop safe enough to check an overpair your almost always going to get bluffed on turn when villian has air. As for having AK, what about checking flop and pushing most turns if he bets? 
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#22
11-23-2007, 09:18 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'd check behind here w/ AA,KK vs this villian as long as I had a diamond. I love letting these overaggro monkeys hang themselves. [/ QUOTE ] If someone is calling 3bets insanely light and check/raising every flop why would you do this? edit: I'm seriously confused by this entire thread [/ QUOTE ] i'm confused also. can u just explicitly write out what u mean by Villain's range and tendacies?
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#23
11-23-2007, 09:26 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
If he's calling 3 bets insanely light but not check/raising air on the flop and check/raising made hands then you should 3 bet and cbet the [censored] [censored] out of him
If he's calling 3 bets insanely light AND check/raising with air all the time then you should still 3bet a lot but bet/call a lot on the flop, and occasionally check behind choose which statement fits best and roll with that
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#25
11-23-2007, 09:32 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
[ QUOTE ]
He's out of the small blind, so I imagine his PFR is around his average of 16% of hands. Download pokerstove and look at how much trash there is in a lot of that range. I can't even fathom him calling a 3 bet with any repetition whatsoever with more than maybe top 6-7% of the range. Then after he calls with this severely restricted range I again can't fathom him c/r'ing more than 60% of the time. If he's doing something more often he'd probably be broke within days. a)because air makes up a very small % of his bluff pushing range What? So you're saying he simultaneously calls a sick amount of 3 bets then check raises the flop all the time but he rarely has air? So he either check/folds a lot or check/calls the flop with air intending to take it away later? wtf??!! He must have a jamie gold sized luckbox then. [/ QUOTE ] You're really good at picking up on things that haven't been written. I never said villain plays a sick amount of 3 bet pots, just that its not super rare. He probably 4 bets or folds all easily dominated hands and calls with hands that can flop good and whose relative strength is apparent. He's also not making this move "all the time", because he doesn't have to do it all the time for it to be profitable, and also there's metagame considerations against light 3 bettors. It's also highly dependant on flop texture and opponent. This particular flop is a good one to make a move on with air. He also has a VPIP of 23 from the SB, and is actually a 0.61BB/hand winner over a decent sample, so its probably safe to say that he's a very good BoB player(obviously i didn't know this at the time). If he's opening this much and being profitable, he's probably defending that money too.
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#27
11-23-2007, 09:38 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
That's fine, i wasn't sure. I have been trying to think a lot about ranges and game theory lately because i think its the biggest gap between SSNL and MSNL, and also something that i'm quite weak at.
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#28
11-23-2007, 09:43 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
For reference, this is an example of what i'm talking about. Villain is 16/13, and a 2+2er (obviously different because its not BoB, but villain knows my stats and 3 bet tendencies).
Party Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter MP: $100 CO: $98.32 BTN: $94.13 Hero (SB): $101.38 BB: $118.92 UTG: $60.05 Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (SB) UTG folds, <font color="red">MP raises to $4</font>, 2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $14</font>, BB folds, MP calls $10 Flop: ($29) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players) <font color="red">Hero bets $21.50</font>, <font color="red">MP raises to $86 and is All-In</font>, Hero folds Results: $72 Pot MP shows 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], a pair of Twos.
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#29
11-23-2007, 09:46 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
i feel like im getting levelled by this entire thread...fonkey is like the only one making sense.
seriously just stick a range into pokerstove...you only need 35% equity to call profitably. given your read that he'll c/r bluff and such i gave him a conservative range of TT+, 88, QdJd, JdTd and AQo (the only hand i assigned him that hes bluffing) and you have 40% equity. this is a call imo note: by sticking in AQo there i obv dont mean that this is what hes bluffing with neccessarily, i just stuck in one bluffing hand to make up a small part of his range...it can be pretty much w/e....
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#30
11-23-2007, 09:46 PM
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Re: Getting levelled in 3 bet pot
[ QUOTE ]
That's fine, i wasn't sure. I have been trying to think a lot about ranges and game theory lately because i think its the biggest gap between SSNL and MSNL, and also something that i'm quite weak at. [/ QUOTE ] game theory? i dont think so. I never use it anyway (not that i would know how to)
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