$1/$2 NL B&M - Mediocre hand vs MANIAC

[ffr]

Let me preface this by saying I play 99.9% of my poker online and rarely play live games. So I’m still trying to get an understanding of the crazy betting and calls of those bets (especially how many people see a flop no matter what the preflop raise) in live games compared to online.

So I'm playing $1/$2 NL and this hand comes up vs. the TOTAL MANIAC of the table with a very big stack (not earned by stellar play, I can assure you). He has called HUGE bets WAY behind with weak hands/draws and consistently hit his miracles to grow his stack.

I played with the same maniac the night before and he couldn't lay down anything at all. If he had a weak hand, but improved with the board even the slightest he would just call down almost no matter what the betting. He would also call down with ANY type of draw, even gut shots if the bet to him wasn’t huge.

Ok, so I'm sitting one off the button and he's just to my left on the button. I pick up Qd/Jd. EP raised to $12 (which in this game was one of the smaller preflop raises!!!). 3 callers by the time it gets to me and I know Maniac to my left will call also so I decide to see the flop (everyone at the table has pretty healthy stacks especially me and the maniac). Maniac does call and both blinds fold.

$75 in the pot and the flop comes Js/10d/2/d. I hit top pair and the flush draw. It gets checked to me and I bet out $50. No surprise, maniac calls and everyone else folds.

$175 in the pot and the turn brings the 6s (board of Js/10d/2d/6s). I'm first to act and I still feel I'm ahead of his range with my top pair even if I don't hit my flush draw. I bet out $100 and he quickly calls.

$375 in the pot now. I have another $425 and he has me covered. The river brings the 10/c (board of Js/10d/2d/6s/10c). This card wouldn't normally worry me, but against this maniac he sure could have called me down with any 10.

I decided the pot was way too big for him to give up on if he missed his straight or flush draw (which I thought were very possible by him just calling me down and not really considering a raise at any point). If I fire out a bet here I take away his bluff if he does have that missed draw so decided to check to him.

He shoves all his chips forward putting me all in for my last $425 if I call.

At this point I have to call $425 to win $800.

I thought for a while and just couldn’t decide if I thought he missed one of his possible draws or had the 10 and is now finally confident enough in his hand to really bet it. I thought (not sure if I thought or just really hoped) there was a good enough chance he missed a draw and the pot was laying almost 2-1 so I called.

Who wins here?


Win or lose, I don’t feel I played the hand well at all so what mistakes do you think I made that I should work on correcting?

[ffr]

Any comments?

[Sykes]

How often does he bluff here?
How fast did he go all-in?

Honestly, with your hand and your stack and the position you have against maniac, I think either check/call turn or check/raise all-in on turn is better than firing out on turn.

Also, I really like throwing out a $100-150 blocking bet on river.

[ffr]

I only played with this maniac for about an hour the night before and he was a total luckbox calling huge bets when it was clear he was way behind, but got there a few times. This session he had a huge stack (I know you might think...two sessions in a row with a big stack must mean he's not that bad, but trust me his winnings did NOT come from smart plays. He had simply been getting his money in BAD and hitting his miracles). He was the type of player that if a pot was checked to him, he couldn't help firing at it, although usually it was on the flop or turn and never for a large amount in the pot or a large amount bet. I never witnessed a hand with him where the pot grew to a sizeable amount and then it was checked to him on the river.

He fired the all in river bet after a few seconds. It also looked like he was originally going to bet a smaller amount and changed his mind to shove all in. This was another small factor that made my decision to call. It seemed to me he was going to bet x amount and then thought..."no, I better bet more if I want him out".

(if you make the blocking bet of $100-$150 and he re-raises all in, would that change your decision?)

[ValarMorghulis]

You don't see big bluffs much in live poker. Just fold.

When you described the maniac, you described him calling loads with crappy draws which is standard for live play. But they generally don't make massive bluffs when they miss. Betting when checked to in smaller pots is much different to massive riverbet bluffs for these players.

[thac]

[ QUOTE ]
You don't see big bluffs much in live poker. Just fold.

When you described the maniac, you described him calling loads with crappy draws which is standard for live play. But they generally don't make massive bluffs when they miss. Betting when checked to in smaller pots is much different to massive riverbet bluffs for these players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right, that's what I was thinking when I read the description of opponent. When a station comes alive and starts betting, they have it. They don't bluff any draws that missed, just fold.

[ffr]

This is what I was afraid of. I won the pot as he did have the missed flush draw. Just after the hand, I really kept thinking I called with the hope he missed rather then real logic that he missed. I got lucky this time, but I was very curious to see what players here thought about the river call.

Do you see any other things you might do different throughout this hand?

[thac]

~125-150 on the turn, other than that you played it fine.

[Jeff28]

FFR,

Well played.

I play a lot live and would play this hand very similar OOP vs. a maniac.

If he really made trip 10s, he would probably bet something small enough to get paid. After all, you bet $100 on the turn and live donkeys seem to bet a number in some multiple of the turn like 100-200 when they hit to get paid on the end.

This smells like a bluff and you made a good call.

Playing big pots in live 1-2 NL vs. maniac donkeys is a good thing. Just suck it up and make the call. This is a crappy J, busted flush or straight draw much more than 50% of the time.

--Jeff

[Big_Jim]

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He has called

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couldn't lay down anything

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[ QUOTE ]
he would just call down

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[ QUOTE ]
He would also call down

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Sure doesn't SOUND like a maniac...