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  #11  
Old 11-29-2007, 01:58 PM
Quester Quester is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

[ QUOTE ]
We need about 34% equity to make the call.
We get close to that with a range like this :
Hand 0: 32.905% 30.53% 02.38% 51678 4027.50 { JJ }
Hand 1: 67.095% 64.72% 02.38% 109557 4027.50 { TT+, AdKd, AdQd, AdJd, KdQd }

But if we take out TT we are never better then 20%.So we hope here he does this with a pp smaller than JJ or some bluff ?

[/ QUOTE ]

This range is too wide IMO. You won't see KK-AA here often at all, and you won't see AdJd because we hold the Jd. I think the range is more like:


Board: 6s 5d 2d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 49.223% 45.59% 03.64% 7221 576.00 { QQ-TT, AdKd, AdQd, KdQd }
Hand 1: 50.777% 47.14% 03.64% 7467 576.00 { JdJh }

Which makes it an easy call.
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  #12  
Old 11-29-2007, 01:59 PM
Casper05 Casper05 is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

"You wont see KK-AA here often at all"

umm, what?
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  #13  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:01 PM
Quester Quester is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

[ QUOTE ]
"You wont see KK-AA here often at all"

umm, what?

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you implying players at this limit don't often 4-bet AA/KK from UTG?
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  #14  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:01 PM
pokerclaudio pokerclaudio is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

easy snap call? 66 and 55 not an option? I mean, it's generally not the situation, but ...
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  #15  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:06 PM
Babalatexi Babalatexi is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

From my experience on party, AA and KK here would be very rare. I don't even remember the last time I've seen someone slowplay either of them unless it was a fish just limping in pf.

Edit: My image is nothing crazy, taggy 19/16 although I may 3bet more than your average guy at these stakes.

Edit 2: I don't remember how long he took to shove, multitabling...
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  #16  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:12 PM
aka_bebel aka_bebel is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
We need about 34% equity to make the call.
We get close to that with a range like this :
Hand 0: 32.905% 30.53% 02.38% 51678 4027.50 { JJ }
Hand 1: 67.095% 64.72% 02.38% 109557 4027.50 { TT+, AdKd, AdQd, AdJd, KdQd }

But if we take out TT we are never better then 20%.So we hope here he does this with a pp smaller than JJ or some bluff ?

[/ QUOTE ]

This range is too wide IMO. You won't see KK-AA here often at all, and you won't see AdJd because we hold the Jd. I think the range is more like:


Board: 6s 5d 2d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 49.223% 45.59% 03.64% 7221 576.00 { QQ-TT, AdKd, AdQd, KdQd }
Hand 1: 50.777% 47.14% 03.64% 7467 576.00 { JdJh }

Which makes it an easy call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why can't he have KK/AA often?There is no rule you have to 4bet AA/KK PF every time.
My mistake for putting AJ there but I still don't think we should call this .I think we still hope be does this with something smaller than TT or some bluff to make this a call
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  #17  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:15 PM
Resistance Resistance is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

You'll sometimes see AA/KK/QQ here
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  #18  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:17 PM
Quester Quester is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

Sure, but "sometimes" isn't "often." If you want to include KK/AA in your range, then go ahead. But I'd recommend you discount them at least somewhat.
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  #19  
Old 11-29-2007, 02:27 PM
sh58 sh58 is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

i am never ever folding on this flop, it is about the best flop you can ask for w/o a J on it
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  #20  
Old 11-29-2007, 03:19 PM
bilbo-san bilbo-san is offline
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Default Re: 3-bet pot AI decision NL 100

[ QUOTE ]
I know its not a reliable tell, but how fast did he shove? Like, I doubt he instashoves here with TT, JJ or even QQ.

Even with great odds I think this is a fold. Against JJ+ and two overs with a FD (AQhh AKhh) you are about 25/75.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see posts like this all the time. Maybe you are right, maybe not.

But I'm pretty sure I have never seen a reg fold JJ in a spot like this, ever. In villains spot, I shove a lot of hands, and a lot of bluffs, especially vs. ppl who 3-bet a bit liberally. And when I shove, I'm never thinking "Maybe he'll fold JJ", lol.

I just have my doubts that any of you who advocate a fold here ever actually do it at the table.

And by the way, I snap call because I 3-bet just light enough to piss people off and get bluff-shoved on a lot, and because I am a station.
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