Things it took me a while to learn part 4, Bankroll management

[Frankzan]

I would like to have an option to self restict my buy-ins, like for example $55 MTTs and SNGs, 0.5/1 cash. If i want to raise my limits there would be a couple of days delay. They do have depositing limits working like this.

At least it could save me spewing drunk after barnight.
Been there, done that [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[umistboy]

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I would like to have an option to self restict my buy-ins, like for example $55 MTTs and SNGs, 0.5/1 cash. If i want to raise my limits there would be a couple of days delay. They do have depositing limits working like this.

At least it could save me spewing drunk after barnight.
Been there, done that [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

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Awesome idea. Think this wouldn't get approved by Stars though as busting means more deposits into their "community" - but I love the idea.

[ettorek]

Very nice thread full of interesting infos.
Barry you did a great post especially for people like me who are in "where is the leak" mode: shorcuts to master the different phases of an MTT are gold.

[jcg2005]

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In terms of Bankroll management, what can I do to get a sick heater?

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You have such good understandings of the game and I'm sure your next big score is just around the corner. Honestly, I'm surprised you only have that one time big score under your belt? Or is it that you just don't practice what you preach?

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I think I can answer that, publicly, since it may provide some insight (doubt it)?:

Well, Rocco, back last year, I basically only played cash games, for the wrong reasons, without thinking at all about the game. I had one "big score" when I luckboxed in a tourney. You could play this game for 20 years based on emotion and "competitive spirit" as opposed to logic/match and not make a buck. You could find yourself 3-betting in all the wrong spots for a year if you are so inclined.

I only started playing tournaments and actually posting/reading in SSMTT about February of this year. A couple of months I made a lot of really brash plays - I think experimentation is important to an extent. I play Part-time and have like 200 tournaments and 300 SNGs under my belt since then. Maybe the biggest problem is that I don't play enough. I also think I learn slow, but I say this with as little ego as possible, I learn well.

I'd say that I started "practicing what I preached" in July of this year. If I fall into that category of "better poster than player," well that sucks. But my plays are merging very close to my posts. And that can't be bad.

fwiw, of the 200 tourneys I've played, I've had a few "nice scores." Just not the coveted 2 - 5K, which I'd love to have and ocassionally gripe about not getting to (it would behoove me to stop the griping).

Barry

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Barry,

I've played MTTs for 20 months or so (not always exclusively) and I have never had a 4 figure cash. I've had two very near 4-figure cashes, but never had a 4-figure cash. Part of the reason is of course that I play in a lot of "low variance" MTTs with small fields that produce lots of cashes in 3 figure ranges. But I don't think it is all that uncommon to go 300 MTTs w/out a major cash (depending on the types of MTTs you play).

Sherman

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This is refreshing to read because it sums up my situation so similarly. TY for sharing.

[bobbycharles]

Bumping this because, like a lot of you, I've struggled with effective bankroll management. But I think I've come up with a plan and I'd like some feedback.

A little background first.....notice my Reg. date and number of posts....been here a while, and not a real active poster. I'm a recreational player - but have that dream - WSOP ME, big cash in the Sunday Million etc. This dream has on several occassions busted me or nearly busted me.

Despite having a slightly positve ROI (3% woo!) I realized finally, why I haven't had better success. My ITM percentage is fine, my percentage going deep (FT's, wins etc is fine.) The problem is playing outside of my bankroll far too often.

See if this sounds familiar if you're a SSMTT'r. Deposit $50 or $100. Enter a couple of $4 180's - god they're disgustingly soft - "god how does that donk make that call." OOOh, look a $11R Turbo to the Sunday Game - sweet - qualified! T$ Baby - $215 of them!! On a roll... $11R $35k guarantee, another $11R Sat, $39 Sat, and a few days later, where'd my $T go? Sound familiar? It's my history over the last couple of years. Sure, I've had some nice cashes along the way, and actually managed to go a year and a half playing WAY over my BR surviving mainly by Sats to the Sunday Million.

Now, I'm 42, and most of you are young pups, but the wisdom some of you possess, is beyond your years. One nugget came in Timex's Well post...talk about a young pup! In it he said that one of the things that led to his success was he learned to not chase the big score w/o the bankroll. (Can't remember exactly how he said it, but that was the jist).

So after 2 years of haphazard tourney entries and struggling to stay afloat, I've become a B/R nit. In fact, I've put together a set of rules that I've been following for almost thirty days now - I know, small sample, but hear me out.

See, I checked my stats on OPR for the $2 Sats to the $100k on Stars. On a small sample size, I discovered I had a 40% ITM. Doing the math, I thought, hey, here's my answer.

Here are my rules: (feedback wanted)
1. Grind only $2 Sats until I have $165.
1a. once over $150, use the 2% max buy-in rule
2. With my roll now at $165, use $150 as my new floor. Allow myself 1 opportunity to play a larger satellite ($5R to the $55k), but limit the buy in to $15. (realize this may reduce your odds of qualifying).
3. If I qualify, take the $T and set a new base level at $200.
4. I allow myself to take another shot at a bigger Sat if I just qualified in one. (Play the rush) However, if I don't qualify the second time, go back to grinding the $2 until I have enough to take another shot.
5. Continue the above targeting the Sats to the Sunday Million and raise your base levels by $200 each time you qualify.
6. Taking shots at bigger tourney's is acceptible if you grind back your buy-in using the $2, before trying again.

The net of the above is that you are always raising your base bankroll and allowing yourself the chances to take a shot or two to a big game.

Result so far playing recreationally (4 - 5 tourneys/day)

Starting B/R Sept. 28, 2007 ---- $22.57
B/R Oct 26, 2007 --------------- $148.89

I had a god awful run last week going 0 for 19 before finally cashing, thus decimating my ROI, but I feel good so far.

What do you think? Is this a realistic process?

I'll check back, and if the thread is too old and few people respond, I'll repost as its own thread, as I think there may be some validity to this process.

[baltostar]

I prefer BR = 200x avg buyin. I think that's about where ROR gets pushed to 2 sigma for the avg good player with a few percent edge after rake.

Max buyin = 5% BR is about right, but you have to closely track what your avg buyin really is. It's easy to lie to yourself.

[fsoyars]

Where does my online roll stop and my real life monies begin? What is a standard proportion of roll to savings?

Also, after bustoing my roll and then building it back up to a fraction of what it used to be... how do I deal with the fact that I can't bring myself to play buy ins <$50, even though I should be?

[BarryLyndon]

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Where does my online roll stop and my real life monies begin? What is a standard proportion of roll to savings?

Also, after bustoing my roll and then building it back up to a fraction of what it used to be... how do I deal with the fact that I can't bring myself to play buy ins <$50, even though I should be?

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lol, why don't you ask your friend on AIM about it? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].

I dunno - you are easily a top rated SSMTT player. Some of your moves are somewhat questionable, but always within reason. Take the plunge and play a bigger one? You're a beast, there is no reason that you shouldn't be playing at higher levels and learning how to pwn them.

Barry

[fsoyars]

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Where does my online roll stop and my real life monies begin? What is a standard proportion of roll to savings?

Also, after bustoing my roll and then building it back up to a fraction of what it used to be... how do I deal with the fact that I can't bring myself to play buy ins <$50, even though I should be?

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lol, why don't you ask your friend on AIM about it? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].

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ZING!!! Wp, sir.

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I dunno - you are easily a top rated SSMTT player. Some of your moves are somewhat questionable, but always within reason. Take the plunge and play a bigger one? You're a beast, there is no reason that you shouldn't be playing at higher levels and learning how to pwn them.

Barry

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Hmmm maybe my arrow was pointing the wrong way? What I meant was, I am used to playing buy ins over $50 exclusively, but now that I have severely damaged my online roll, I SHOULD move down but I can't bring myself to play smaller stakes bc I haven't done it in so long.

edit: thanks for the props. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]