50NL: AK flops a K and gets donked into (big preflop pot)

[O.T.G.]

Villain is 18/12/3. Is this one of those spots where calling is best? A raise will probably only be called if I am beat and a fold is obviously too nitty right?

Full Tilt Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (8 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

Button ($19.25)
SB ($79.10)
BB ($16)
UTG ($20.55)
UTG+1 ($81.45)
MP1 ($39.50)
MP2 ($20)
Hero ($60.05)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. MP2 posts a blind of $0.50.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls $0.50, MP1 calls $0.50, MP2 (poster) checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $3.5</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, UTG+1 calls $3, MP1 calls $3, MP2 folds.

Flop: ($11.75) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets $10</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero ????

[coordi]

I normally put him on a weaker ace or the same hand. FD is possible though so i tank and shove since he only has 26 left.

[davidwrunner]

If u call u are committed to at least the bettors stack - some concern that players behind u may be strong 2.
I think a min raise to $20 will induce him to push/fold and u will see where other players stand

[wikemang]

shove

[O.T.G.]

Ok good. I did shove for the reasons you all stated above. I just need to figure out how to stop losing money to these players who limp and call OOP and outflop me every time.

[thehempy]

easy shove with the stack sizes.

[sapol]

when you commited 7 BB PF it was in order to flop something and take another player's money.
Well you flopped TPTK and an opponent bets into you which is basically the best you can hope for.

SHOVE !!

[Albert Moulton]

[ QUOTE ]
I normally put him on a weaker ace or the same hand.

[/ QUOTE ]


A guy with 18/12 preflop is not going to limp/call with a hand like AT,AJ,or AK. He'll raise.

I think top-pair + weak kicker + FD is certainly possible, but so is 2-pair, SFDs, and sets.

His range is probably {77,55,Ac9c,Ac8c,A7s,Ac6c,A5s,Ac4c,Ac3c,Ac2c,9c8c, 8c6c,75s,6c4c} against which AdKd has 29% equity all-in on the flop.

Yes, we have the donk bettor covered. But UTG+1 still has to act and he has us covered. If he was going for a c/r, then we completely stack off.

Somebody explain what's wrong with calling then pushing (or calling an all-in from MP1) on a blank turn where our equity over his range goes up to 50% or more (i.e. ~60% is the turn is Qd), but folding to a push from MP1 on a club turn (i.e. ~4% equity if the turn is Qc). Also, if we call the donk bet and UTG+1 goes all-in and MP1 calls, then our hand is gargage and we can fold.

Comments?

[AllTheCheese]

[ QUOTE ]

A guy with 18/12 preflop is not going to limp/call with a hand like AT,AJ,or AK. He'll raise.


[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, but they shouldn't be discounted entirely. He could've decided to play ATs or AJs as suited Aces rather than as top-pair hands, hence his second-limp.

[ QUOTE ]

His range is probably {77,55,Ac9c,Ac8c,A7s,Ac6c,A5s,Ac4c,Ac3c,Ac2c,9c8c, 8c6c,75s,6c4c} against which AdKd has 29% equity all-in on the flop.


[/ QUOTE ]

This is a fairly reasonable shove-calling range but I don't think this is his donking range. If he can have Ac6c, there's nothing to stop him from having Ah6h and be donking to "see where he's at".

[ QUOTE ]

Somebody explain what's wrong with calling then pushing (or calling an all-in from MP1) on a blank turn where our equity over his range goes up to 50% or more (i.e. ~60% is the turn is Qd), but folding to a push from MP1 on a club turn (i.e. ~4% equity if the turn is Qc). Also, if we call the donk bet and UTG+1 goes all-in and MP1 calls, then our hand is gargage and we can fold.


[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is fine. We don't figure to be a favorite against an 18/12's shove-calling range here. Also, as you hinted at, a raise commits us against UTG+1.