10/20 ftp. how not to play ak deep stacked.

[Newt_Buggs]

Do you guys have any history? Unless he is a huge nit or you have a reputation of a huge nit I would definitely shove preflop and I don't think its close. If you call the pot is 35% of your initial effective stack sizes and beeing oop is pretty sick.

Some numbers: if villains 4 betting range is TT+,AQ+ in this spot and his range for calling an all in is QQ+,AK then shoving has a positive expectation of $159 here.

[Moonshine]

wtf shove preflop or fold man

[LB_001]

Seems like a weird play by villain, I'm not as convinced as everyone else that you're beat by the river... only hand I see him playing this way is QQ. Seems like a perfect flop to bet KK/AA/random bluff after 4 betting preflop and seems pretty bad to 4bet AQ/AJ preflop with these stacks. Doubt JJ would bet the ace turn after checking the flop for pot control. Then again you obviously only beat a bluff on the river and its a pretty bad spot for villain to bluff again after you call the turn. If I think villain is capable of making a sorta bad/weird bluff in this spot though I think I'd call.

[BalugaWhale]

if you fold AK pf, what are you not folding?

[cts]

don't stop reraising him preflop

[mj2]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ia m small stakes player, but I can see folding in 2 palces:

1 st when BTN repops you to 600$ pre (I would fold here)
2 nd On turn when he bets out pot (bcoz you cant really beat anything except air and he will push river regardless and that is really terrible spot to be in)

but if money is that deep I insta fold pre when BTN repops to 600$.

[/ QUOTE ]

You do know that people have been known to 4bet light, esp when it looks like hero is just trying to resteal.



[/ QUOTE ]

i've noticed people seem to be 4 betting much lighter recently. here is a similar hand from last night. obvious difference is we are not deep. we have average 100 bb stacks. the villain has a tight image. 18/15. i can't see folding ak preflop when people are 4 betting this light.


Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $10/$20 Blinds - 4 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

Hero (SB): $2,217.00
BB: $5,046.00
UTG: $2,070.00
BTN: $1,842.50

Preflop: Hero is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 Players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $70.00</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $230.00</font>, BB folds, <font color="red">UTG raises to $575.00</font>, Hero calls $345.00

Flop: ($1170) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">UTG bets all-in for $1,495.00</font>, Hero calls $1,495.00

Turn: ($4160) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

River: ($4160) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $4,160.00 ($2 Rake)

UTG had 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (a pair of Fours) and LOST (-$2,070.00)
Hero had A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (a pair of Kings) and WON (+$2,088.00)

[JooWish622]

Can someone explain to me why shoving with AK preflop, given the laggy nature of this game, is a mistake???

Why are we calling here? Is it because its more +EV? Is shoving with AK here marginally EV (given that we sometimes folds otu better hands (or worse hands)) and calling wit hAK here is more +EV???

-Joo

[etown]

not sure how often you three bet from the blinds but if its often
i think you should rr the 600 and take a line as if you had kk or aa
if your calling the 600 it would be because your assuming that if you hit your ace or king your good
and if thats the case than you might as well put him in now and hope he eiter folds his qq or jj or at least youll see the other two cards with all your money in the middle