Free card to induce an A-high call down

[emerson]

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I think if I were in your spot I'd just call pre-flop.

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That gets my vote as well. You can check raise the flop like 98% and donk/3-bet flop almost as often(against aggressive players).

[Captain R]

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I think if I were in your spot I'd just call pre-flop.

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That gets my vote as well. You can check raise the flop like 98% and donk/3-bet flop almost as often(against aggressive players).

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I considered just smooth-calling preflop. But to make it profitable, I need to get in 3 small bets on the flop somehow (donk/3-bet is most likely to work, I don't think Villain would 3-bet my check-raise with A-high). It also makes it hard to play if an Ace flops.

I think just smooth-calling with AA is a lot easier to play out the rest of the hand. Thinking more about this, with AA Villain is more likely to have a big overpair (instead of Ax) + higher probability that an Ace will not flop = more action on the flop/turn.

[brettbrettr]

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But to make it profitable, I need to get in 3 small bets on the flop somehow

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I kind o09f see what you're getting at but kind of don't. The point of calling pre-flop is to get in a ton of bets. Some boards will allows you to do this, some won't.

[Captain R]

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But to make it profitable, I need to get in 3 small bets on the flop somehow

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I kind o09f see what you're getting at but kind of don't. The point of calling pre-flop is to get in a ton of bets.

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I agree -- "a ton of bets". To be more specific, I need to get in about 3 small bets in on the flop. If I 3-bet preflop and assuming he peels one off on the flop, that's 2 small bets I'll probably get out of the guy at minimum.

So by smooth-calling, I need to get those same 2 bets + more to make it higher EV. If I check-raise the flop and he calls (pretty likely) this is equivalent to a preflop 3-bet. So to have it more EV than 3-betting preflop, I need to gain an additional bet somehow (that's why I say I need to get 3 small bets on the flop somehow).

So I basically need to get a donk-3-bet scenario going to get ahead.

In other words, I lose 1 SB by not 3-betting preflop that I have to gain back somehow postflop + preferably more.

[CardSharpCook]

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A gamble that paid off this time. I hate the idea of giving any ace or pocket pair a free card here. You never know if it gained a bet because you never know whether he would have called the turn.

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Did it? There's a chance he's calling both streets with AK. AK is the nuts, you know.

[emerson]

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In other words, I lose 1 SB by not 3-betting preflop that I have to gain back somehow postflop + preferably more.

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You really only lose with the smooth call vs the 3 bet when he checks behind on the flop. When the same number of bets go in, your ev with the smooth call was higher because your bet on the flop had higher ev than the preflop raise. You made it with greater information. You had a choice to do things differently depending on how the flop looked.

[ActionBob]

Most players call down with AK unimproved anyway so no need to get fancy.

-ActionBob

[Captain R]

BTW, for everyone mentioning AK -- I didn't know he had AK obviously. My read on the turn was that he had either some kind of pair or Ace-high. And that if he had a pair, he would almost always bet it when I checked on the turn. Not exactly genius, I know...

If I knew he had AK, I would be more inclined to bet the whole way hoping that he hoped I had AK/AJ.

I guess at this time I was trying some super-wacky form of what elindauer's essay on "Strategy adjustments for small pots: Inducing bluffs" talks about. I hadn't yet read his essay at the time, but it brings up something I was experimenting with in what I see is the totally wrong context.

[MitchL]

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BTW, for everyone mentioning AK -- I didn't know he had AK obviously. My read on the turn was that he had either some kind of pair or Ace-high. And that if he had a pair, he would almost always bet it when I checked on the turn. Not exactly genius, I know...

If I knew he had AK, I would be more inclined to bet the whole way hoping that he hoped I had AK/AJ.

I guess at this time I was trying some super-wacky form of what elindauer's essay on "Strategy adjustments for small pots: Inducing bluffs" talks about. I hadn't yet read his essay at the time, but it brings up something I was experimenting with in what I see is the totally wrong context.

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Well you posted the results in your OP so its in everybody's head and the whole thread is pretty results oriented. That being said it is generally a good idea to pound out of the blind, bc for some reason people get overly curious when you do.