Razz - defending the bring-in (attn SG Special)

[DrewOnTilt]

SG - kinda curious what you were doing in this hand (Seat 3) especially 3rd and 5th streets. Is this a standard defense? Villain seemed bad but was in early position.

Razz ($8/$16), Ante $1.50, Bring-In $2 (converter)

3rd Street - (1.13 SB)

Seat 2: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 3: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___brings-in___calls
Seat 4: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 5: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___completes
Hero: 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds

4th Street - (3.13 SB)

Seat 3: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets

5th Street - (2.56 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets

6th Street - (4.56 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 5: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets

Total pot: (4.56 BB - $73)

[ChipsAhoya]

I would play this the same way if the pot was a little bigger (full table or a better ratio than 1:4 B/I:SB) or I had a Q or J up for the extra 4 or 8 outs to a better hand. I consider myself a looser b/i defender than I should be, but I'm sure SG will visit and explain.

-ChipsAhoya

[HOWMANY]

Don't really see how it matters what position the villain was in, all the upcards other than his are bad so he completes. Against a bad player I would gladly reraise with your hand because I don't care that he can see that I just reraised him with a 9 up. Against normal players I would reraise 964 in this situation as long as the 4 or 6 was up.

[ChipsAhoya]

This isn't about Drew's hand, it's about SG's defense w/ his King.

-ChipsAhoya

[HOWMANY]

Yeah I covered that already. The villain completed with a 7 because all the other upcards are bad so he basically has 2 random hole cards. SGSpecial calls with a couple wheel cards because he can see that the villain has a 7 and there are no other good upcards so the villain has 2 random hole cards, I don't really see anything out of the ordinary. Against a good player this is probably not a spot worth getting involved in, against a bad one I doubt it can be too bad. It won't be an easy hand to play but I strongly suspect it will be profitable.

[DrewOnTilt]

honestly i didnt even think about reraising with my 964 (9 was up) - maybe I should have. Razz is weird. Indeed a nice break from holdem.

Regarding SG's hand - it's true that Villain did raise vs. a bunch of high cards on 3rd, but I saw this Villain as someone who didn't seem to think much about his hand. SG had just joined the table and has played more Razz on FT than I have, so maybe his read is different.

I'm still curious as to why he called on 5th street. His board is pretty ugly.

[oscillator]

pretty standard if youre calling someone out.

[betgo]

The K's defence is OK with the right cards. OP should also call with (64)9. I wouldn't reraise with the 9 showing.

[SGspecial]

[ QUOTE ]
The K's defence is OK with the right cards. OP should also call with (64)9. I wouldn't reraise with the 9 showing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, a thread just for me [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I'd like to thank Drew for posting it, and betgo for taking a break from being balla to come comment, etc. etc.

While I don't discuss hands I've played in the forums unless I post them myself, I will make a few comments. This is a very common steal attempt for a villain given the upcards and a pretty standard spot to defend your bring-in, and I do have notes on the villain in question so I did not need to be at the table long to have a read on his usual play. There have been a few threads previously on 2p2 dealing with bring-in defense, which led to two opposing articles appearing in the 2p2 magazine last year to address this topic.

Happy reading!

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]

I'd like to thank Drew for posting it, and betgo for taking a break from being balla to come comment, etc. etc.


[/ QUOTE ]
I like that title, but I am not really that balla, although I play the higher stakes razz games on FT. I think I got it because I turned down an offer to be captain of the NJ team (due to TLB points) in Stars "World Cup of Poker". It could also be because I was the short stack in a $1K live MTT 3-handed. The big stack was considering calling an allin. I left to go to the restroom and found out we were HU.