Somali Freedom Fighters

[Steven Bickford]

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/25/wo...mp;oref=slogin

Beyond clan rivalry and Islamic fervor, an entirely different motive is helping fuel the chaos in Somalia: profit.

A whole class of opportunists — from squatter landlords to teenage gunmen for hire to vendors of out-of-date baby formula — have been feeding off the anarchy in Somalia for so long that they refuse to let go.

....

Perhaps some of our resident ACists will go join the fight for this noble cause.


***Edit/Jman220: Please post all further discussion of this topic HERE

[Steven Bickford]

Perhaps now we can put to rest the following argument made by Borodog: "There's precious little capitalism in the Thrid World, and hence there can be no anarchocapitalism, including Somalia. Asserting that Somalia is anarchocapitalistic is simply a canard."

There is capitalism in Somalia, as this article clearly indicates. Moreover, even if there were not capitalism and respect for property rights in Somalia, that would also be an argument against anarchocapitalism. Repsect for property cannot just arise out of thin air in an anarchist society. Government is necessary to culivate and protect the idea of property rights.

[ConstantineX]

I knew this would be posted. =P

[pvn]

[ QUOTE ]
There is capitalism in Somalia, as this article clearly indicates. Moreover, even if there were not capitalism and respect for property rights in Somalia, that would also be an argument against anarchocapitalism. Repsect for property cannot just arise out of thin air in an anarchist society. Government is necessary to culivate and protect the idea of property rights.

[/ QUOTE ]

How can you have capitalism without the "idea of property rights"?

There's no professional hockey in Somalia. Professional hockey only exists where there is government. Therefore, government is necessary to cultivate and protect the idea of professional hockey. QED.

[mosdef]

[ QUOTE ]
Repsect for property cannot just arise out of thin air in an anarchist society.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true. Anarchy would/will only "work" (i.e. result in a stable environment where the rights it seeks to defend are in fact defended) when property rights and the feasibility of anarchocapitalism are accepted.

I would say that this would be possible if the majority accepted the core beliefs of AC and accepted the risk of trying to implement them. The ACists will avoid the word "majority" like the plague, I am sure, and have said things like "widely accepted", but I'm not sure I've ever really understood the difference.

[Nielsio]

[ QUOTE ]
Government is necessary to culivate and protect the idea of property rights.

[/ QUOTE ]


And what about respecting and protecting property rights; does 'the government' have a role in that?

[Nielsio]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Repsect for property cannot just arise out of thin air in an anarchist society.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true. Anarchy would/will only "work" (i.e. result in a stable environment where the rights it seeks to defend are in fact defended) when property rights and the feasibility of anarchocapitalism are accepted.

I would say that this would be possible if the majority accepted the core beliefs of AC and accepted the risk of trying to implement them. The ACists will avoid the word "majority" like the plague, I am sure, and have said things like "widely accepted", but I'm not sure I've ever really understood the difference.

[/ QUOTE ]


When people believe in the virtue of the biggest mafia, then surely one will arise.

[Steven Bickford]

[ QUOTE ]

How can you have capitalism without the "idea of property rights"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because capitalism is just the absence of regulation

[Kaj]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

How can you have capitalism without the "idea of property rights"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because capitalism is just the absence of regulation

[/ QUOTE ]

No it isn't.

A does not equal B. Not hard to really understand.

A: "Men who were able to muster private armies, often former military officers, seized the biggest prizes: abandoned government property, like ports and airfields, which could generate as much as $40,000 a day. They became the warlords. Many trafficked in guns and drugs and taxed their fellow Somalis."

B: "Capitalism generally refers to an economic system in which the means of production are mostly privately[1] owned and operated for profit, and in which distribution, production and pricing of goods and services are determined in a largely free market. It is usually considered to involve the right of individuals and groups of individuals acting as "legal persons" or corporations to trade capital goods, labor, land and money."

[TomCollins]

[ QUOTE ]
Government is necessary to culivate and protect the idea of property rights.


[/ QUOTE ]

So since government is made of people, where do these people get the idea for cultivating and protecting property rights?