20$ Rebuy, failed bluff in late stage - reasonable play or suicide?

[Tackleberry]

20$ Rebuy MTT, prizepool 20K, 250 players reg., 37 remaining, 30 places are paid.

Villain is chipleader at the table (60.000 chips) and has a medium aggressive style.

My image is rather tight, two hands ago I won a big pot with a reasonable hand.

The following hand arrived:

Blinds 600/1,200
9-handed table

Villain is SB (60,000)
Hero is BB (27,000)

Preflop: Hero has 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

<font color="green">7 fold</font>, <font color="red">SB raises to 2,400</font>, <font color="red">BB reraises to 6,000</font>, <font color="red">SB calls 3,600</font>.

<font color="purple">After all had folded and SB made a normal (steal-)minraise, I decided to pull off a bluff as I am slightly below average and had to need to accumulate chips. Unfortunately I didn´t scare the chipleader off the hand.</font> [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue"> (pot: 12,000, 2 players) </font>

<font color="red">SB bets 1,200</font>, <font color="red">BB calls</font>.

This min-bet of just 10% of the pot I could not assess at all - if he had a monster, why did he not try to check-raise me? Was it a small probe-bet to see what I have? No fear of the two-suited-flop? Maybe AK[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]? Why then this small bet? Or maybe AQ[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]? Finally I made an awkward call with my middle pair, getting at least 10:1 and hoping for the turn.</font>

Turn: J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue"> (pot: 14,400, 2 players) </font>

<font color="red">SB bets 1,200</font>, <font color="green">BB folds</font>.

<font color="purple">Same question!! What would SB give me 13:1 with, with which he called a big preflop-reraise? The only reasonable hand would be AK[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]/AQ[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. But again - if I would call this micro-bet I would surely also call a bet of maybe one third of the pot. Thoughts? I admit, I really have no clue. What are you setting BB´s range on?</font>

=&gt; At all, how do you comment my play? Was it a reasonable bluff in my situation or pure suicide? Would anybody have come over the top (or pushed?) the flop in my situation - regarding his minbet as pure weakness?

Thanks for your comments!! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Tackleberry]

No comments?

[JoeyJoJo Shabadu]

[ QUOTE ]
No comments?

[/ QUOTE ]

PRF fine.. why not put him to the test.

Raise the flop (4000?)... you've come this far and have 2nd pair... see if he hit his king. At the very least it's buying you a free river card.

Calling never gives you much info. As played I fold the turn as well.

[nath]

your preflop reraise size blows
and you should jam the flop

[ianisakson]

raise more pf, raise the flop. you gotta make up your mind early in the hand when you're going to bluff and play your hand strong the whole way through or you're going to end up giving up a lot on later streets in hands like this. put him to the test, from my experience you're ahead about 80% of the time on the flop here.

[LSgambler]

Preflop re-raise to 7.5-8k. Push this flop.

[SkyyCaptain]

Okay he called a raise preflop (rather than reraise) ergo he probably doesn't have AA, or KK and likely not QQ. I've seen all kinds of people who minbet when they've made their hand but its a strange phenomena usually relegated to microstakes.

His small bet is a ridiculous and should be ignored. He's more or less checked this flop. It's a moron's attempt at a stop bet and I can't believe you're seeing this at a 20 dollar buy. You should raise here lets say you push up to 1/2 pot + his bet. If he REALLY has a K he'll call, and you can call yourself done with this hand(barring a miracle) again tho, if he's min betting I'd call to the river just for information. He may have an 8 or even a trey. Usually min betters are bad enough that they play the same way consistently and this one is curious enough....He's chip lead so he may just be one of the min betters that shoves the river. (I've seen this tactic also at microstakes but never anywhere else).

At this point tho I think you should attempt to glean why he's min betting and it may be worth a small chunk of your stack to find out. Min bettors are generally consistently bad players. My guess? TPWK. or 2nd pair. If this is the case he'll probably call other top pair hands (in which you will assuredly have a better kicker)

If he lived this far he knows to give up weak hands when he's getting too much action so ... I might play back at him.


He could be a couple kinds of things, and none of them are great. He's either hit the nuts, or he's betting scared. Find out if which, and in a later experiment, whether he's willing to play back at you(probably not but either way you can use this).

This is excessively bizarre.

I agree you need to raise more preflop, he's getting too much in odds to lay down unless he's got some of the absolutely worst hands. and if he's aggressive he might play those on a low flop. You should raise to just a little over 3x his raise.

Raise him on the flop for more info, if he's minraising I'd probably expect a call and another minraise. Fire a second round (don't make it a full 3/4 pot these people don't think like us). If he's still here he'll almost certainly check the river and you can check down to figure out what the hell kind of game he's playing.

[Tackleberry]

Hi guys,

thanks for your hints and esecially sky – thanks for your precise and detailed explanation. Your thoughts will (hopefully) help me finding the right decision next time. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

But let me see, if I got the details right: I should raise him preflop about 3x his bet, assume 7.5k. On the flop I should raise his minbet to about half potsize + his bet, so let´s say around 7k again. At this time I already spent half of my stack. The pot has about 30k at this time with me having about 14k left. What else can I do, than shove the turn? Or did I misunderstand you?

[lemming]

donk min bets from chipleaders are often weak from what I experienced (not very experienced though in comparison to other players here [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img])...

I raise this flop to 7.5k or so, if I really want to take this pot down, calling shows weakness imo... Dunno if it's the best thing to do, but if I want to resteal PF, I very often give it another shot on the flop if he donks, works pretty well for me...

[The Hag]

This was played horribly on all streets.

I don't know what else to say.