Stud Hi - Poker Tracker Questions

[PoorLawyer]

somewhere in the 20-26 VPIP seems pretty standard for a tight winning player. I tend towards the 25% in low games and towards 20 in higher games. I think you really need stats in the 6 figure number of hands played before you really know where you are long term and can settle your BB/100 into a confident range.

If you can keep the BB/100 number that you are doing now, you are ahead of 99% of the player base. I dont really datamine so my database isnt huge, but I have over 6800 players logged with over a million hands and only 38% are in the green with the average stats being (2.56) BB/100 with a 36.95 VPIP. Of people with more than 1000 hands, there are only 46 over 1 BB/100.

[FishSticks]

Yah obv 2000 hands is nothing in terms of statistical significance. I have like 500k hands of NLHE in my DB so I've seen hot/cold stretches of 20k hands and what not.

I would assume, though, that although BB/100 takes a *long* time to converge, stuff like VPIP and raise 3rd converge rather quickly.

Glad to hear 20-26 VPIP is standard for a TAG. I thought I was playing super rock tight this whole time, too!

[FishSticks]

Oh, and does anyone have thoughts on Raise 3rd%? My Raise 3rd is less than half of my VPIP, and my initial feeling here is that this is a bad thing. Perhaps limping a bunch of stud isn't the cardinal sin that it is in NLHE, I dunno. My aggression goes up on later streets, but on 3rd I'm pretty passive. Is this bad?

[Poker CPA]

Very much so

[FishSticks]

[ QUOTE ]
Very much so

[/ QUOTE ]

... meaning my raise 3rd is way too low?

So a VPIP <26 and a Raise3 of >15 would be solid taggish stats?

[Poker CPA]

Fish

Please define "TAG". Is it "Tight agressive" or is it "Tough agressive". Huge difference in stud. (Not sure about razz or stud/8). Its not so much what you think of your own playing style, but more importantly, knowing how other players define you as a player. And then using that information against them.

"... meaning my raise 3rd is way too low?"

Lets jusy say, you would be a easy target at higher limits. Your stats are weak/tight IMO. But I don't play your limits, so I could be wrong. You need to work on being a "Tough" player, not a "Tight" player. A much higher % of "Tough" players are winners, then "Tight" players.

Poor Lawyer's comments above are very accurate

"somewhere in the 20-26 VPIP seems pretty standard for a tight winning player. I tend towards the 25% in low games and towards 20 in higher games. I think you really need stats in the 6 figure number of hands played before you really know where you are long term and can settle your BB/100 into a confident range.

If you can keep the BB/100 number that you are doing now, you are ahead of 99% of the player base. I dont really datamine so my database isnt huge, but I have over 6800 players logged with over a million hands and only 38% are in the green with the average stats being (2.56) BB/100 with a 36.95 VPIP. Of people with more than 1000 hands, there are only 46 over 1 BB/100"

Now instead 1000 hands, use 3000 hands and then the 1 BB/100 starts to look pretty good. So your BB/100 is unrealistic over the long term. To obtain a accurate measure of your BB/100, you need to play at least 240,000 hands. This would give you 8, 30,000 hand cycles. These cycles run hot and cold for a stud player. Cycle 1, you hit everything (life is good); cycles 2 - 4 are profitable; 5 and 6 are breakeven; 6 is a loser and cycle 8 is a real dog.

So which 30,000 hand cycle are you in ????????

The differences between a "tight" player and "tough" player over 240,000 hands are HUGE. So what winning BB/100 is acceptable for the time and effort, because its not just about winning, but about making serious cash.

[FishSticks]

Thanks for the response. I'm quite sure I *am* a huge fish at high limit stud games :-)

[Nina]

At lower stakes (up to 2/4 imo) I always find maniacs, gold diggers and the ordinary fish. There are numerous examples of bad play being awarded. Eg:

-I raise pf with aces (holecard A), one player calls til the river. River is checked. Villain has been calling with a pair of threes Q kicker... no draws. Obv he hit another small pair at the river.

-I limp in with AQJ, I catch an ace on 4th and bet. I get raised with XXK4. Set? Two pairs? I call and hit my second pair. Villain raises and is all-in. Baaaad bluff against a betting ace. His holecards were 38. LOL.

Some stats from three sites 1/2 FL (first site average and then my stats in parenthesis. I still don't think my VPIP is exaggerated high in comparison with the average at the sites and the limits... ok ok... a little):

BB/100 0.04 (4.13), -1.24 (4.20), -0.82 (7.18)
VPIP 36.04 (32.54), 40.96 (34.13), 38.23 (33.32)
3SR% 4.39 (4.14), 3.40 (3.12), 4.27 (4.07)
W$SD 48.18 (51.54), 46.93 (50.75), 46.68 (50.84)

I should be more aggressive!

BTW good post about tight and tough!

[Poker CPA]

So Nina, your stats are:

Site 1: VPIP 32.54%, 3SR% 4.14%
Site 2: VPIP 40.96%, 3SR% 3.12%
Site 3: VPIP 33.32%, 3SR% 4.07%

Please confirm

[RustyBrooks]

Looks like site 2 you got the wrong number for vpip.

And the 3sr numbers seem very low.