NL25 QQ gettin minraised

[HighCardSeven]

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.10/$0.25 Blinds - 5 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $14.65
BB: $27.45
Hero (UTG): $25.60
CO: $33.45
BTN: $26.15

Preflop: Hero is dealt Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 Players)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $1.00</font>, 3 folds, BB calls $0.75

Flop: ($2.10) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $1.75</font>, <font color="red">BB raises to $3.50</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $10.25</font>, BB folds

Pot Size: $15.85 ($0.45 Rake)

Villain was 16/10 after 37 hands. As play, okay?

[PJo336]

def played ok

[Milky]

Looks good. He's probably raising with a draw and hoping for a free card on the turn. Punish him now... If he had a set he'd most likely b/3b or c/r bigger since the board is drawy.

[CyberianBull]

Def looks good. Villain's bet is the same as a donk bet into you OOP on the flop. Like you raise with QQ and the flop is the same as above and he just pots into you. I think they are the same types of bets that suggest the villain is holding a med/sm pp with overs on the flop that contains no paint or a flush/strt draw. This is especially true if the villain is like a 40/10. So i think it's a good spot for the hero bluff as well if you know the villain has these tendencies -- any thoughts?

[Milky]

[ QUOTE ]
Def looks good. Villain's bet is the same as a donk bet into you OOP on the flop. Like you raise with QQ and the flop is the same as above and he just pots into you. I think they are the same types of bets that suggest the villain is holding a med/sm pp with overs on the flop that contains no paint or a flush/strt draw. This is especially true if the villain is like a 40/10. So i think it's a good spot for the hero bluff as well if you know the villain has these tendencies -- any thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. I see this quite a bit. Many people will donk into you thinking you have overs and once raised they figure you have an overpair and fold. Which is why making note of this habit can make you some money when you actually do have overs and they donk into you. I've started using traz's abbreviations: dbf (donk bet then folds to raise) or dbc (donk bet then calls). I'd say the majority of the time it's dbf which is why I'll raise a donk bet the majority of the time.

[Subzero_Wins]

I don't like this.

I think you're only being told it looks good because he folded, if he would have shoved you'd have gotten different answers and been in a horrible spot.

I would call and re-evaluate the turn unless I knew he was a moron, which this guy isn't.

[wslee00]

does he really have a draw here? seems more like TPTK type hand w/ the c/r. I asked before in another thread, but do villains typically c/r their draws in 25NL?

[Antinome]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like this.

I think you're only being told it looks good because he folded, if he would have shoved you'd have gotten different answers and been in a horrible spot.

I would call and re-evaluate the turn unless I knew he was a moron, which this guy isn't.

[/ QUOTE ]

If he shoved you would instacall and be happy because there are lots of worse hands you can be up against and there is way too much dead money in the pot.

Normally I like to wait until the turn to maximize our equity, but here there are so many draws possible we won't have any idea what card helped him, and we'll end up checking again; letting him get to the river and bail once all the cards are out.

[ApeAttack]

[ QUOTE ]
does he really have a draw here? seems more like TPTK type hand w/ the c/r. I asked before in another thread, but do villains typically c/r their draws in 25NL?

[/ QUOTE ]

Only a small percentage would do this. More often villains will bet out with a draw or c/c.

[Subzero_Wins]

We're only happy to call a 4-bet shove because we're getting 3:1 and that's obviously a +EV call. That is an easy call, but we don't want to put ourselves in that spot. Look at the type of hands he can have.

1) Top pairs: He's almost always folding to the 3-bet. Since he CRed so small he doesn't have enough money in the pot that he can say "well this could be a draw" and call.

2) Draws: Just about every draw other than JT and 67 not of clubs has more than 8 outs. A lot have 11-14. He's got a huge chance to draw out on you if you're ahead.

3) Sets/89: You're pretty much gone if he has one of these. You may lose less if you just call but you're in bad shape against these either way.

So against top pairs and sets, calling is clearly better. Draws are close but if you're post flop play is good you're better off waiting and putting it in on the turn. You have position, use it.