Home games skill factor...

[Mickey Mouse]

Hi, ledies and gents!

I'd like to ask a question and would appreciate a few thoughts on the subject.

I'm wondering in which poker variant (NL/LHE, Stud or Stud8, Omaha or Omaha8) a skillfull player have the biggest edge over a non-deep thinking opponent (a player who playes only for fun of it and doesn't think to much about the game - a tipical home game player). I'm thinking in terms of one night game or a few hours of play.
It's a small stakes game.

I've been debating with friends but we couldn't find a definitive answer.

My two cents is that NLHE is probably most complicated game of them all, but there is a lot of bluffing and all in moves, so when money is not a big thing it's questionable... Stud is relatively simple and if you can remember all the cards you can do pretty well (maybe, lol) against opponents who chase a lot, plus there's one street more for betting. Omaha has the most luck involved, I think; there's just too many drawing possibilities so everything can happen.
I don't have much experience in Hi/Lo games...

Again, I'm talking about small stakes home game, not pro poker.

Any thoughts?

Thx.

[wsock23]

The hi/lo games obv.

[pzhon]

If you really want to skin your sheep, I think pot limit Omaha would be the way to do it.

First, many casual players can't read the board. Some don't realize that you have to use both hole cards in Omaha, and have a hard time seeing all of the straight possibilities, e.g., that you don't have the nuts if you have J9xx on an AKQTx board.

Second, the hand evaluations are very different from those of Texas hold'em. When a flush is possible, it is much, much more likely that someone has a flush, and even the nut flush is common. When the board pairs, it is much more likely that someone made a full house. Casual players will overplay overpairs and two pair hands and low sets, hands than would be fine in Texas hold'em, but are more like bluff-catchers in Omaha.

Pot-limit also allows casual opponents to make mistakes making tiny underbets, and to get clobbered when they get outdrawn or overvalue a hand.

While O8 offers many other ways for casual players to make mistakes, I think it takes longer to get their money.

[Mickey Mouse]

Thx for the replys, guys!!

Very good point, mister pzhon. But, don't you think that just because there's so many draws and misreads many players would chase too many hands and hit much more than they should??
I mean, i have a feeling that at least 5 ppl will be seing the river almost every hand and with that many possibilities anything can happen and most of the time they will catch something. LOL (pardon my english)

I just can't have the nuts every time I enter the pot. And it would be hard for me to beat the game where too many players chase... I don't know.

What do you thing of Stud high or Stud 8 or better??

Thanks again.

[foal]

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And it would be hard for me to beat the game where too many players chase...

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Not really, you just have to play tight. If you don't like variance it could be a problem, but it should definitely be profitable.

[VivaHate]

Whatever game is your strongest is surely most profitable. It will also be easier to adapt and exploit their mistakes in a game that you excel in.

[tarheeljks]

i'm w/pzhon. it's pretty easy to fleece bad omaha players, buckle up for the swings though.

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Whatever game is your strongest is surely most profitable. It will also be easier to adapt and exploit their mistakes in a game that you excel in.

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not necessarily true. the disparity in skill from game to game is more important than what op's strongest game is.

[Javanewt]

I agree with pzhon.

Bad home players are going to try to draw in any game. In Omaha, they rarely realize they are not drawing to the nuts and often think they have a hand when they don't. If you understand the game and are fairly good at it, you should win -- I think more than in the other games.

However, you can't be playing weak starting hands and "drawing" too or it's moot.

[VivaHate]

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i'm w/pzhon. it's pretty easy to fleece bad omaha players, buckle up for the swings though.

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Whatever game is your strongest is surely most profitable. It will also be easier to adapt and exploit their mistakes in a game that you excel in.

[/ QUOTE ]

not necessarily true. the disparity in skill from game to game is more important than what op's strongest game is.

[/ QUOTE ]

True if OP is compotent in all games, but if he's barely break even in stud or poor at PlO he won't have the skill to exploit his opponents weaknesses.

[pzhon]

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the disparity in skill from game to game is more important than what op's strongest game is.

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I agree. I'd much rather play othello against an unknown player than backgammon, even though I am a world-class backgammon player, and nothing special in competitive othello. I'll win less than 75% of backgammon games even against a bad player, but over 90% of othello games against someone who only knows to fight for the corners.

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if he's barely break even in stud or poor at PlO he won't have the skill to exploit his opponents weaknesses.

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Yes, but it takes only a few minutes of instruction to tell someone how to crush an Omaha (high) game filled with Texas Hold'em players.

[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Draw to the nuts.
[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Play coordinated hands, where all 4 cards work together like T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], not hands where you like 2 cards, like Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] or A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. If you only like 2 cards, they better be AA, and then you either want to get everything in preflop or flop a set.
[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Don't get excited about bottom set, or hands that will make bottom set.
[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] A raise on the river represents the nuts in pot-limit.

In a home game, I called a round of Omaha limit, and a tight Texas Hold'em player raised me on the river with 2 pair. I think it was supposed to be for value, but it was a bluff.