Played Poker With A White Supremacist Last Night

[*TT*]

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TT (or RR) how would your rooms handle this guy? Do your rooms have no abuse policies? Where I play they do but it usually is enforced with swearing or berating another player over how they play. Would you be able to do something just for the guys tatoos or would another player have to complain first? What would you do - ask the guy to cover up or leave?

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Mr WT -
People grow up, they change, they realize they made mistakes in the past. Getting a tattoo that is offensive is a mistake that is not easy to change, its a red flag that there might be a problem but until there is an issue I generally just ignore it because it might just be a mistake from his past.

If the individual says anything bigoted or racially offensive I'd notify the floor and ask to have him removed, this type of customer is not in the best interest of the casino if he causes trouble but until that time comes (IF that time comes) he is innocent.

[Gonso]

Takes more than a racist tat to get you thrown out of a poker room, they put up with a lot that other places won't

[Rottersod]

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Mr WT -
People grow up, they change, they realize they made mistakes in the past. Getting a tattoo that is offensive is a mistake that is not easy to change, its a red flag that there might be a problem but until there is an issue I generally just ignore it because it might just be a mistake from his past.


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I'm going to assume that if someone I meet is covered in swastikas and other neo-nazi tattoos that they are what they are representing themselves to be. Choosing to ignore it and hope that he has "changed his evil ways" is no better than putting your head in the sand. I can state categorically that if someone of his description sat down at my table I'd rack up and leave, even if he was the biggest donator in the room. I fought against punks like these years ago when I was with the JDL and I have no interest in being in the same room.

[SNOWBALL]

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Mr WT -
People grow up, they change, they realize they made mistakes in the past. Getting a tattoo that is offensive is a mistake that is not easy to change, its a red flag that there might be a problem but until there is an issue I generally just ignore it because it might just be a mistake from his past.


[/ QUOTE ]

I'm going to assume that if someone I meet is covered in swastikas and other neo-nazi tattoos that they are what they are representing themselves to be. Choosing to ignore it and hope that he has "changed his evil ways" is no better than putting your head in the sand. I can state categorically that if someone of his description sat down at my table I'd rack up and leave, even if he was the biggest donator in the room. I fought against punks like these years ago when I was with the JDL and I have no interest in being in the same room.

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wtf u were a member of a terrorist organization? This thread is quickly becoming epic.

[*TT*]

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I fought against punks like these years ago when I was with the JDL and I have no interest in being in the same room.

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then leave. But dont ask the floor to make the other player leave because of your pre-judgments.

WOW. Meir Kahane was a terrorist, plain and simple. Juts because they put a statement on their website that says "The Jewish Defense League unconditionally condemns terrorism of all forms." doesn't mean that the JDL is any better than Hammas which also makes the same claim yet is an obvious terrorist organization.

In a 1986 study of domestic terrorism, the Department of Energy concluded: "For more than a decade, the Jewish Defense League (JDL) has been one of the most active terrorist groups in the United States....Since 1968, JDL operations have killed 7 persons and wounded at least 22. Thirty-nine percent of the targets were connected with the Soviet Union; 9 percent were Palestinian; 8 percent were Lebanese; 6 percent, Egyptian; 4 percent, French, Iranian, and Iraqi; 1 percent, Polish and German; and 23 percent were not connected with any states. Sixty-two percent of all JDL actions are directed against property; 30 percent against businesses; 4 percent against academics and academic institutions; and 2 percent against religious targets." (Department of Energy, Terrorism in the United States and the Potential Threat to Nuclear Facilities, R-3351-DOE, January 1986, pp. 11-16)"

By your own theory you wouldn't sit a a poker table with yourself even though you are no longer a member of the JDL. Thats hypocrisy in its finest.

A fair man judges a man for his actions as well as his redemptions from his past actions.

PS: I am Jewish. Oddly enough I was held at gunpoint by a member of the JDL when I was 18 because I was in the wrong place at the wrong time, he later apologized. I don't judge the JDL based on the actions of this one individual.

[Poshua]

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Mr WT -
People grow up, they change, they realize they made mistakes in the past. Getting a tattoo that is offensive is a mistake that is not easy to change, its a red flag that there might be a problem but until there is an issue I generally just ignore it because it might just be a mistake from his past.

If the individual says anything bigoted or racially offensive I'd notify the floor and ask to have him removed, this type of customer is not in the best interest of the casino if he causes trouble but until that time comes (IF that time comes) he is innocent.

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I am unconvinced by this. It's true that the tattoos might be a mistake from his past, but if they were and he was truly embarrassed about them (and wouldn't most people be terribly embarrassed if they found themselves with racist tattoos they didn't want?) he would go to great lengths to cover them up. Further, since his girlfriend is also covered in tattoos, he is presumably sufficiently at peace with his tattoos to make them a point of connection in his relationship. I think the most likely case is that he is happy (or at least content) with his tattoos.

But even more broadly, it's just not OK to walk around displaying swastikas or other symbols of white supremacy, except for certain historical contexts not relevant here. By displaying these tattoos, this dude violates rules of common decency. It is reasonable for his fellow patrons to expect him not to show himself like that.

If he were seated across from me, I would ask the floor to have him removed. If he balked, I would complain to the room manager. If they gave me the answer that you did-- that they would wait for him to actually cause trouble, that just showing those tattoos is no violation-- I would leave the room and not come back, even if it had been my favorite poker room.

[JackInDaCrak]

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By displaying these tattoos, this dude violates rules of common decency. It is reasonable for his fellow patrons to expect him not to show himself like that.

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I disagree with this. He's entitled to display whatever he wants. It's not reasonable for anyone to expect him not to show his tatoos - it's his choice. It's your choice whether or not to sit with him. It's management's choice whether or not to remove him.

It would be reasonable for management to ask him to cover up or for management to refuse him service, just as it would be resonable for management to give him a chance and allow him to play until he demonstrates he is a trouble-maker.

Re: "rules of common decency" - well, that's subjective isn't it? You have a problem with his tattoos, some people won't. So, what's "common" about the rules?

He's certainly pushing social boundaries but there's not a per se violation of any "rules." One of the beauties of the society we live in, is that people are entitled to speak their mind, regardless of whether it may offend someone else. Along the same lines, you're entitled to be offended. But this guy certainly shouldn't be denied service simply because of a statement he wants to make.

[RR]

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If he were seated across from me, I would ask the floor to have him removed. If he balked, I would complain to the room manager. If they gave me the answer that you did-- that they would wait for him to actually cause trouble, that just showing those tattoos is no violation-- I would leave the room and not come back, even if it had been my favorite poker room.

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Now he has caused a problem and this is different than if he is just sitting there.

[RydenStoompala]

It's Vegas. They just started allowing African-Americans into the pool areas a few years ago, or is that something that is not widely known?

And if someone is wearing a swaztika, they're a making a serious statment about their penchant for hatred and violence. It's offensive on so many levels that the person wearing it seeks and desires confrontation, so if you make a scene, he gets what he wants. Explaining the impact of the swaztika to this guy would be like debating derivative valuations generated by the Black-Sholes model with him. You'd get a glassy stare and then a punch in the mouth.

The reply stating that really bad guys move around without really being noticed is absolutely right. This wipe is not a real bad guy, he's a racist mope.

[Overdrive]

Post deleted by *TT*