Iraq spending: ROI? - Page 2

theseus51 · #11 10-15-2007, 05:21 AM

Well, ROI is the amount of return. But the dollar has lost so much value, and oil has like tripled in price for us, and I wouldn't even begin to know how to calculate the loss of thousands of American lives.

If you think of oil alone, I think we import 10million barrels, from $25 pre-war to $85 now. Granted oil going up more than 3 fold isn't all to the Iraq war, but I would say a good part is. Even if we say half the price increase is from the war,

$30 * 10 million * 365 = $109 billion a year

War has been going on 5 years, so we lost about $500 billion, just from oil. After spending hundreds of billions on the war, that's at least a -100% ROI. Maybe the real number is -300% ROI, who knows.

UlidEyes · #12 10-15-2007, 05:24 AM

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Who's roll? Assuming you're an average american and not on the Haliburton board you've got far far more in commmon with the average iraqi than anyone whose "padding their roll" from this hideous circus of rape murder and squalour. In fact those same people are stealing from you as well in the form of increased taxes to pay for the war debt.

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Our roll, as in the US government. Most of the dividends would go directly to them. It makes us a wealthier country, helps support our welfare state, and allows educated people to get paper jobs. Although you are right that it's the insiders who are making the most, the corporate and govt high-ups.
As far as war debt, I don't mind paying for it if it's worth the investment.

tomdemaine · #13 10-15-2007, 05:32 AM

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Who's roll? Assuming you're an average american and not on the Haliburton board you've got far far more in commmon with the average iraqi than anyone whose "padding their roll" from this hideous circus of rape murder and squalour. In fact those same people are stealing from you as well in the form of increased taxes to pay for the war debt.

[/ QUOTE ]

Our roll, as in the US government. Most of the dividends would go directly to them. It makes us a wealthier country, helps support our welfare state, and allows educated people to get paper jobs. Although you are right that it's the insiders who are making the most, the corporate and govt high-ups.
As far as war debt, I don't mind paying for it if it's worth the investment.

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The war has cost the US government trillions of dollars and returned nothing. No dividends go to the US government to spend on anything you may want them to be spent on. The whole war is a massive transfer of funds away from the US government to a group of politically connected private citizens that you are absolutely not a part of. That was pretty much the purpose of it and it is succeeding fantastically well. It is a smokescreen so people can rob you blind and make themselves fantastically wealthy at your expense. The fact that you're falling for it and think that you're coming off well financially is immensely depressive not to mention that you're willing to sanction the murder rape and pillage of millions of living breathing men women and children for what you perceive as personal gain is so disgusting that I feel like I want to vomit. You are an evil human being and what's worse is you're not actually getting anything out of it you're just justifying those who are stealing from you and wouldn't go out of their way to piss on you if you were on fire.

UlidEyes · #14 10-15-2007, 05:33 AM

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If you think of oil alone, I think we import 10million barrels, from $25 pre-war to $85 now.

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We're not paying for it per barrel, we're taking it out of the ground, putting it on trucks/planes, and bringing it back. Also, you need to consider the decent positive externalities of having a cheap, limitless oil supply (as it is right now). Just to clarify though, you were implying that we were actually paying for oil, instead of just taking it? Not to mention that high oil prices = good if we're getting it for free and are distributing it to other countries as well.

Jamougha · #15 10-15-2007, 05:35 AM

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Just to clarify though, you were implying that we were actually paying for oil, instead of just taking it?

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Of course you're paying for the oil...

UlidEyes · #16 10-15-2007, 05:39 AM

we're paying for the opportunity to use and secure/defend their oil extraction infrastructure. We're not paying for the oil we extract, we're taking it. Why would we be wasting billions of dollars otherwise, just to kill a few terr'ists?

JayTee · #17 10-15-2007, 05:46 AM

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we're paying for the opportunity to use and secure/defend their oil extraction infrastructure. We're not paying for the oil we extract, we're taking it. Why would we be wasting billions of dollars otherwise, just to kill a few terr'ists?

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You are paying to turn off the valve.

Jamougha · #18 10-15-2007, 05:58 AM

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we're paying for the opportunity to use and secure/defend their oil extraction infrastructure. We're not paying for the oil we extract, we're taking it. Why would we be wasting billions of dollars otherwise, just to kill a few terr'ists?

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lol.

pvn · #19 10-15-2007, 10:57 AM

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everyone is eager to stand up for or against the war in moral terms, but what about looking at it strictly financially? so, is it a net gain for the USA? Is oil really worth that much?

I'll support the war if we're padding our roll with it. Loss of lives is less significant as long as I'm not involved. </honesty>

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Who's padding their roll here?

$8,000,000,000/month of taxpayer money is getting spent. What's coming in?

Last I heard, there's about 1,000,000,000 barrels of oil coming out of Iraq per month. So we're spending $8,000 PER BARREL, ON TOP of whatever the market price is. And "we" (as in the US) isn't even getting all of that oil, it's just going into the market.

Now consider, if all we wanted was the oil, we could have gotten that 1,000,000 barrels onto the market PLUS MORE (the war has caused lots of disruptions in the Iraqi supply infrastructure) and only been paying the market price (which would have probably been lower than it is today) by simply ENDING SANCTIONS.

So, again, who's padding their roll here?

War is a Racket

pvn · #20 10-15-2007, 11:00 AM

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Who's roll? Assuming you're an average american and not on the Haliburton board you've got far far more in commmon with the average iraqi than anyone whose "padding their roll" from this hideous circus of rape murder and squalour. In fact those same people are stealing from you as well in the form of increased taxes to pay for the war debt.

[/ QUOTE ]

Our roll, as in the US government. Most of the dividends would go directly to them. It makes us a wealthier country, helps support our welfare state, and allows educated people to get paper jobs. Although you are right that it's the insiders who are making the most, the corporate and govt high-ups.
As far as war debt, I don't mind paying for it if it's worth the investment.

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So you mean the war isn't a net drain on taxes? We're making money off of the war?

LOL.

So why is bush having to ask congress for more money to fund the war? Why isn't he just using these fat revenues to pay for it?

Have you ever seen Bill Gates call up the Microsoft shareholders and ask them to give him some more money so they can keep their "profitable" operation running?