Flopped straight flush how do I get max value?

[SonofDjugashvili]

I think you have to raise the turn. I agree with Cornell - if he has Ac or Kc, you have to make sure you get paid. If he has a set, he is also going to stay in because he may not put you on the flush, or thinks he has a re-draw. On the river, you might only get paid off by a made flush.

[AC-Cobra]

[ QUOTE ]
This hand brings up a concept that, while many people instinctively grasp, a lot of posters seem to miss.

It is not enough to put the villain on a range in a hand like this: you need to figure out how he will proceed with different hands in his range and how he will react to your actions given the hands he might be holding.

When he bets out on this flop his range is:
[*]Pure bluff (22-88/Ax no club)[*]Set (TT/JJ/QQ)[*]Straight draw/no club (99, A9, K7, K8, A9)[*]Pair + straight draw/no club (9T/J9/Q9/KT/KT/KQ/AT/AJ/AQ)[*]Ac or Kc. No one ever folds an OESFD or a Gutshot SFD. Most of the times that he has a big club he also usually has a pair, increasing the chance that he will never fold[*]Made straight (89/K9/AK)[*]Baby flush

Some of these hands (two pair, set, straight draw) will not continue if a scare card falls.

Some of these hands (Naked Ac, naked Kc) will not continue if a blank falls because their equity plummets.

Some of these pair + draw hands (KT, KJ, AT) will peel the flop but will fold the turn unimproved.

Which hands are we actually getting more value out of by slowplaying our hands? Maybe when he has a total bluff he will fire another barrel if he senses weakness. Any other hand we want to get the money in and pot commit him before he sees a turn card that he does not like.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree 100% with the above. Get your money in on the flop to maximise the chance of him coming along. If he folds, you wouldnt of got a tremendous amount out of him on later streets anyway so this strategy is defintely very EV+.

[zizazziza]

raise the turn. make it like 4500. That way you can shove the river and he might feel pot-comitted to call or he might 3b ai on turn. By raising to 4500 you have increased the pot-size to 9800 and left him with 3700. This means that he might feel pot-comitted to call an ai on the river for ~1/3psb

[JoeyJoJo Shabadu]

My post was supposed to mean... or do what Cornel says and raise the flop.

What hands? Debateable for sure and depends on villian but maybe ...bluffs, AK KQ AQ AJ (meh) KK 99 - all with no clubs. But BB play differs so much from person to person... and time to time. That's the biggest variable here. What did he defend with? I think that expands on the above range by too much to narrow down.

[ThePershore]

[ QUOTE ]
When he bets out on this flop his range is:

Pure bluff (22-88/Ax no club)

Set (TT/JJ/QQ)

Straight draw/no club (99, A9, K7, K8, A9)

Pair + straight draw/no club (9T/J9/Q9/KT/KT/KQ/AT/AJ/AQ)

Ac or Kc. No one ever folds an OESFD or a Gutshot SFD. Most of the times that he has a big club he also usually has a pair, increasing the chance that he will never fold

Made straight (89/K9/AK)

Baby flush

Some of these hands (two pair, set, straight draw) will not continue if a scare card falls.

Some of these hands (Naked Ac, naked Kc) will not continue if a blank falls because their equity plummets.

Some of these pair + draw hands (KT, KJ, AT) will peel the flop but will fold the turn unimproved.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think he would bet more w/ a set, and very likely re raises JJ/QQ pre flop.

I don't think this villian defends his BB w/ A9/K9/89, or 2 small cards.

Am pretty sure this villian wouldn't bet out w/ 22-88 on this board.

So I guess we're probably looking at AcX, KcX or combo hands like KQ, KJ, or maybe 2 pair hands like JQ tho I think he bets out more w/ 2 pair hands to protect them.

If we raise the flop do we raise to ~ t2,200??? I'd raise that much w/ a set, AcX, KcX, AxKx too so my flat calling looks a bit fishy / suspicious?

[ThePershore]

Results below:

Hero is MP1 with ~ t12,000
Villian is BB with ~ t10,000

Blinds t150/t300 no antes.

3 folds, Hero raises to t750 with 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5 folds, Villian thinks for ~ 10 seconds and calls.

Flop Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (Pot t1,650)

Villian hesitates and after 10 seconds bets ~ t900, Hero calls.

Turn 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (Pot t3,450)

Villian hesitates again and bets ~ t1,650, Hero wanted to raise to t3,950 typed it in then called instead.

River 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (Pot t6,750)

Villian time banks for over 30 seconds (wtf??) and bets out t1,000, I put Villian on KcX and retardedly then raised to t3,000 instead of pushing. Villian time banked again for ~ 20 seconds and called.

Think I played every post flop street incorrectly...


Thanks for the replies, esp Cornell.

[ZJ123]

i think calling the flop is fine, but i think u need to raise turn, just insta shove or something, there are many cards that will hurt your action on the river from two pair hands.