Hop on the Criticism Train

[SilentNoise]

chi; if you hit a pair with KQ i think its fine to look to play a small pot and get to showdown, without missing value bets.

but if you dont hit a pair, you want to generally take it down without a showdown if poss

[bijads]

[ QUOTE ]
No because I'm at work. You can I guess.

I completely butchered that hand but how the F does a guy minbet me UTG with 109 and then raise the flop on a gutshot.

I thought he might drop AK (which I thought he had) if I repopped his minraise on the flop so I decided to play it really weird and it [censored] me.

I thought he had KKK on the end once he pushed but since I put $300 in there i had to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

it was a very sick hand. I think your turn/river combo was pretty bad though. I really think the play was to c/r all in on that turn. that guy was never folding AK or AA.

[FGators]

Not being results oriented but does anybody read into his $58 bet?

He's pretty much committed himself to the pot now and I think he's seen me check raise all in on a bunch of turns in the past in 3 bet pots.

[chiTown22]

[ QUOTE ]
chi; if you hit a pair with KQ i think its fine to look to play a small pot and get to showdown, without missing value bets.

but if you dont hit a pair, you want to generally take it down without a showdown if poss

[/ QUOTE ]
So with that strategy for the hand a call oop is better than a 3bet most of the time. Of course you should mix it up a bit, but calling should be the larger percentage decision maybe 70/30ish.

[SilentNoise]

[ QUOTE ]
So with that strategy for the hand a call oop is better than a 3bet most of the time

[/ QUOTE ]

if you hit a pair in a raised pot i think its okay to try and get to showdown and play a smallish pot. but if you hit a pair in a 3bet pot i think its alot harder to play a small pot (obv the pot is bigger), and you may have to stack off if it comes to that.

but i know what you're saying though. calling/3betting both have their advantages/disadvantages. im still kind of undecided myself.

if i have to stack off in a 3bet pot i will.

i dont think the 58$ bet means that hes trying to induce a push or anything. how much do you think he would bet if he wanted you to fold then?

[FGators]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No because I'm at work. You can I guess.

I completely butchered that hand but how the F does a guy minbet me UTG with 109 and then raise the flop on a gutshot.

I thought he might drop AK (which I thought he had) if I repopped his minraise on the flop so I decided to play it really weird and it [censored] me.

I thought he had KKK on the end once he pushed but since I put $300 in there i had to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

it was a very sick hand. I think your turn/river combo was pretty bad though. I really think the play was to c/r all in on that turn. that guy was never folding AK or AA.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I agree and for some reason the Q froze me. I didn't put him on a straight or QQQ but it was more my thought process on getting value out of AK/AA. I thought shoving might let him off the hook.

At the time when the hand was going down I didn't realize how much of a fish this guy was...I knew he was one and pretty bad but I was doubting whether or not he'd drop AK to a shove.

I thought if I just called the turn and practically potted a blank river (which I got) he'd call pretty quickly with AK thinking I was FOS and most definitely call or shove with AA since he was bad.

I thought he might tighten up to a check push if he had AA/AK since KQ got there, the board was something like KJ4Q..and he was now beat by KQ/KJ/QJ/JJJ/444 if he had the two hands I thought he did.

I mean he minraised me UTG, I didn't expect 10 high there. I expected a pretty tight range (AK/AA/KK/QQ--I discounted him having three queens by the flop action as I think anyone would either stick in a real bluffraise or just call my flop lead).

By calling the turn I thought I could slow down if the river got really really ugly by a 4 card straight coming and if I boated up I could potentially check/raise the river all in as I expect this guy to keep firing liberally.

So pretty much I called the turn to take one off in a sense since he bet so small in relation to the pot and then got my blank river in which I thought anyway that I could take a trip to valuetown.

[ofishstix]

can you type up a HH for this hand too??

[FGators]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So with that strategy for the hand a call oop is better than a 3bet most of the time

[/ QUOTE ]

if you hit a pair in a raised pot i think its okay to try and get to showdown and play a smallish pot. but if you hit a pair in a 3bet pot i think its alot harder to play a small pot (obv the pot is bigger), and you may have to stack off if it comes to that.

but i know what you're saying though. calling/3betting both have their advantages/disadvantages. im still kind of undecided myself.

if i have to stack off in a 3bet pot i will.

i dont think the 58$ bet means that hes trying to induce a push or anything. how much do you think he would bet if he wanted you to fold then?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think he would shove or basically shove.

In retrospect I think he probably checks back 88-JJ and probably checks behind KQ/QJ.

And him floating in a reraised pot is kinda iffy.

I think he shows up with sets and pair and straight draws here and thats it.

I lose to sets, I beat like 76,75,86.

[Jay Riall]

POST THE 450BB POT ALREADY

[FGators]

[ QUOTE ]
can you type up a HH for this hand too??

[/ QUOTE ]

I played it really bad because A) the guy was completely awful and prone to overplaying/bluffing hands B) I, like I said a few posts up thought he had AA/AK and he seemed like a guy who was clearly awful at poker (obvious to everyone at the table) but seemed like he would possibly be able to get off AK because the board was truly awful.

Anyway I'm UTG with around $400, I raise to $8 with JJ, guy next to me in middle position makes it $16, folds back to me I call. Villain has $400 himself.

Flop: K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I lead $35, he doubles it to $70 (it was some minraise, maybe I lead $30 he made it $60), I decide to call because I didn't have a spectacular read on the guy and thought he might be able to fold AK if I shoved (as I played more with him I found out I wa SOOOO SOOO wrong)

Turn: Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I check, he bets $50, I call $50.

Check my analysis a few posts up on why I check/called here. I considered leading again but the Q froze me as I thought if I check/shove I only get called by better (KKK/QQQ) and he folds AA/AK since he loses to JJJ/QQQ/KKK/444/QJ/KJ/KQ....what I learned later is that this guy is a complete fish/station and would have snapcalled.

River: 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I lead for $166 thinking I'm going to value town, he puts me in for $128 more and I call

He shows 10 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and rakes in the $832 pot.

Clearly I played the hand bad and should have had a clearer read on the guy but there is the butchery.

I just couldn't put him on that hand and I probably should have worried less about getting value out of AA/AK (I kept thinking what the best possible line would be to stack those two hands because honestly that's what I thought he had) and more about just taking the pot down or the fact that this fish is not folding anything.

Once again, too, I underestimated/overestimed how bad he was. I knew he wasn't good but clearly he wasn't folding aces no matter what board came.