Moving Up (tl;dr)

[QTip]

The reason for this post is to encourage others who are aspiring to move up in limits. Here's my story. (btw, this isn't a brag post, although I am proud of what I've done in NL. However, we all know how poker can be sometimes, so I'm thankful that I didn't get the doomswitch for 30k hands or whatever. I've been fortunate as I moved up as well.) I went from micros to mid stakes in basically 5 months of play. I don’t think I’m anyone special or a great player.

Background: I played almost a million hands of limit FR before I started NL. I had about a year and a half break in there as well. Anyway, I share that to say that I did have a lot of poker experience before I started NL. Not the same game, of course, but I had a lot of time invested in learning to read hands, boards, different lines against different opponents, multitabling, etc.

We have many reasons for playing poker. I had decided that upon my return, I was playing to play bigger...move up in stakes. So, this is for those starting who are like I am in my reasons for playing. The danger with this is usually that you move up quicker than your skill level improves...saw it in limit often…and that’s ok.

The Story:

April + May 2007

On April 1st, I deposited $250 into UB. I figured that would be my roll for the NL10 game. I played around a bit and mostly 1 or 2 tabled while I played NL10. I was trying to learn the game. I posted quite a bit here trying to pick something up here or there. Of course, I got all the books and read those as well.

I got the deposit bonus there, and started the terrible process of clearing that. I did that for about 2 month. At the start of June, I had put in 14k hands. I had played nl10 pretty straight forward. I just waited until I hit a big hand and value bet the crap out of it.

I had 10k hands in of NL10 at 10 ptbb/100

I also tried NL25 a bit. At that point, I had put 5k hands in of that and was pretty much even at +$1.47

June 2007

I didn’t play in June almost at all…only 5k hands and was pretty much break even there….but I had spent quite a bit of time reading books and learning.

July 2007

I decided to really get serious with NL at this point. I opened up accounts at FT and used my old PS account and started multitabling. I cleared those bonuses during this month as well. I decided I wanted to really focus on getting my roll bigger in a quick way. So, I started focusing on clearing my FT bonus and getting a $650 PS bonus. So, I started to 20 table.

I put in 10k hands of NL25 at 4 ptbb/100 and started NL50

I spent quite a bit of time at NL50 I put in 60k hands of it and ran at 2.0 ptbb/100.

At the end of the month, I got in like 7k hands of nl100 and pretty much broke even.

August 2007

I did some shortstacking here while 20 tabling as well. I was just trying to build up points and get used to the bigger #s as well.

I put in 10k hands of NL100 and ran at 3 ptbb/100
I also put in 25k hands of NL200 and ran at 2.8 ptbb/100
I even put in 2k hands of NL400 and ran at 3 ptbb/100

Not all of this was shortstacking, but a good deal of it was. It’s an interesting thing to do; however, I didn’t enjoy it at all.

It was a good time of building the roll as I got my $650 bonus from PS as well.

September 2007

I decided that this month was the end of shortstacking. I also had purchased PNLHE the week before, and that was really helping me think about the game as well.

I put in 43k hands of NL200 at 4.6 ptbb/100
I put it 3k hands of NL400 at (1.3) ptbb/100

I had an $8k month tho with bonuses, and I hadn’t really thought that would come for a long time.

October 2007

This month has been a great step for me.

21k hands of NL200 at 3.5 ptbb/100
21k hands of NL400 at 2.8 ptbb/100
18k hands of NL600 at 3.66 ptbb/100
1k hand of NL1000 at (0.7) ptbb/100

A whopper month in terms of $ for me, and I’m well rolled for these games now and feel very comfortable.

Summary and My Pointers:

Be aggressive as you move up. There are plenty of poor players at every level. I went up with like 15 buy ins for every level, sometimes a bit sooner. Don’t feel like it’s a failure to abandon ship on a move up. I would do so after losing 5 buyins and had to do that a couple times. Poker can throw some serious fits, and we all have plenty of things to work on in our games. Always think about the game in terms of BB instead of money. This helps you not to freak out when it’s time to push $600 or whatever in someone’s face.

Learn to multitable. It’s really the quickest way to move up. Yes, this can stunt some growth, so make sure you’re focusing on learning as well. You can’t make money without getting the hands in, period.

Introduce a few tables of the new level for a while. Sometimes the shock of the bigger numbers can do some damage. I have always played 2 levels higher before moving up..just for a bit. You could even ss it if you wanted. This just make the #s look smaller when I went down to my “new” level. So, when I played NL100, I started with like 2 tables of NL200 and the other 10 with NL100...then later made 6 of them 200, and so forth.

Focus on the fish. You’re just not going to make much money in the long run from other tags imo. Most of the regs in the games I’m playing now are better than me. I do my best not to tangle with them too much, but I’m scared to either if you know what I mean. The point is tho, get a good seat on a fish and focus on getting in hands with them.

Don’t get caught up in FPS. I really think this has a heavy impact in online play. It often seems like the one to get out of line 1st loses. Reads are so much more difficult online, so when you wait for others to get out of line, you profit. This doesn’t mean to never bluff, 3 bet light, etc. But, as is always the case, better starting hands make better hands in the long run. Don’t get caught up in the machoness. Keep a level head.

Always focus on learning. Never stop reading, posting hands, replying and so forth.

My Goals:

I’m really not sure how much longer I’ll stay at FR. If I can maintain even half of my earnings in October, I’d certainly have no reason to complain. However, the games are getting less and less available at these levels. So, I’m seriously considering 6m.

Anyway, that’s the story. GL to you in your moving up.


Here’s a money graph and a BB graph.

[the_main]

tl;dr




but I will after my session [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Zeclion]

Very nice post! Has been added to my favorites.

[LearningCurve]

Q-Tip,

You already know this as I've told you before, but your rise up has been very inspiring. From reading the fine details it definitely wasn't all easy. 20-tabling means you put a good number of hands into the process. I also know that you spent at least as much time responding to posts as you did in making posts of your own.

Fantastic story, great work, and I wish you the best of luck in tackling and conquering 6-max. GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO!

LC

[Das Budrick]

I am inspired.

I've recently moved up to 100nl, played 21k hands at 2 ptbb/100. However 2k hands ago I changed my style from 15/8 to 16/12, with much better results. As soon as I finish clearing some bonus money (5k more hands) I'll take a shot with a ~$3k roll at 1/2. Hope I fare well!

[gieffe]

you're definitely moving up fast and with no fear. i admire that.
i notice that you are pretty much keeping the same bb/100 rate in every level you play... that is also impressive. do you adjust your play when you take shots at higher stakes?

i am also trying what you are trying: playing at a higher level at one table only while multitabling. it is working fine for the moment but i'm not as confident as you are.

your post is a boost of confidence for me.

thanks

[CallMeJohn]

Good Advice Q-Tip.

I recently moved from 100NL to 200NL and i found i independently stumbled upon some of your suggestions.

I know i treated moving up in stakes as a big mental road block. When i finally made the move and became comfortable with the bet sizes, i realized the game played exactly the same.

hopefully my move to 400NL is not as delayed.

[Brimstead]

very encouraging post

i moved up limits a couple of weeks ago and am breaking even over 10k hands.... glad to see the same happened to you at some stage, yet it came good in the end

[Djcoax]

Very nice post but I'm a bit confused regarding your personal story. I read some QTip threads today about you going pro and then going back to regular work again , saying you won't be posting much at these forums.

I gather you're back ? Where's the missing post ?

[QTip]

[ QUOTE ]
you're definitely moving up fast and with no fear. i admire that.
i notice that you are pretty much keeping the same bb/100 rate in every level you play... that is also impressive. do you adjust your play when you take shots at higher stakes?

i am also trying what you are trying: playing at a higher level at one table only while multitabling. it is working fine for the moment but i'm not as confident as you are.

your post is a boost of confidence for me.

thanks

[/ QUOTE ]

All responders: Glad to see that this is encouraging to others.

gieffe, to your question about adjusting as you move up:

I had experience with this in limit. I'm not sure if everyone is this way, but I always find myself wanting to play more aggressive when I move up to another level. I kinda feel like I have to do this cuz that's what the big boys do. However, this normally blows up in my face. Now I try to tighten up some and be even more paitent. We're looking to minimize variance until our roll is comfortable at the new level.


Here's another tip I did. Also, you may want to experiment playing like a 60x-80x stack when you first enter the level. This helps hands play easier until you start getting data on your regs and find out who you're opponents are, then you can buy in full it if makes sense.